#488: Award-Winning Loyalty for Cinema Lovers with Club Pathé

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Hello, and welcome to today’s episode of Let’s Talk Loyalty featuring an award winning brand in the entertainment sector in the Netherlands with more than 30 cinemas around the country, Pathé Theatres welcomed more than 14 million visitors in 2023, showing renewed interest from consumers in enjoying the cinema experience.

My guest is Loyalty Manager Joyce Mensah, who led the original design of Pathé Rewards, which won two International Loyalty Awards back in 2020. Joyce joins me today to share the latest enhancements of their loyalty strategy. And some of the innovative ideas they’re using, such as their premium subscription model. Their goal is now to achieve a simpler, yet a more fully integrated experience for cinema lovers. Featuring a comprehensive loyalty and digital brand proposition for members called Club Pathé. I hope you enjoy my conversation with Joyce Mense from Pathé Cinemas in the Netherlands.

So, Joyce Mense, welcome to Let’s Talk Loyalty. 

Joyce: Welcome! Excited to be here. 

Paula: Great. I’m excited. I can hear, I can see that you’re excited. I know our audience can’t see you, but I can assure you, Joyce is somebody we’ve been wanting to talk to a very long time, given her award winning work with Pathé Theatres, a brand that I wasn’t previously with, familiar with, but certainly very impressed with that, with what I’ve seen. 

So we have a lot to get through today, Joyce. As you know, we’re going to start in a very familiar place for our audience. My goal with this question is to get a sense of what you as a loyalty professional, what you admire and what you look to for inspiration. So I’m going to kick off with our usual opening question. Joyce, what is your current favorite loyalty program? 

Joyce: Okay, I’ve not chosen to use your suspect, but I think it’s very inspiring and next gen for you and it’s the Armin’s All Access. Armin van Buuren is one of the best DJs in the world. It’s Armin’s All Access or AAA. It’s a fee based community for fans of Armin. 

Paula: Fee based? Is that what you said?

Joyce: Yes. 

Paula: Ah. Okay. 

Joyce: Yeah. And actually it’s all about digital ownership. How it will help you bring long lasting relationships. And I think that they did a great job in creating value using the power of community. 

Paula: Wow. 

Joyce: So, what they did, they, they sold a limited number of tokens which gives you exclusive access to the world of Armin van Buuren. And so, a channel in is Armin’s Discord server. Fans engagement by Q and A’s meet and greets with with Armin. It gives you access to exclusive events and release music, early access on new tracks, merchandising as as well. And well, I think it’s the most powerful is that it didn’t just launch the NFT concepts, but they developed a three year plan for the community.

So not just interesting at the start, but yeah, always also preventing the concept from trying out. And I think that’s the biggest risk for NFT initiatives at this moment yeah, to maintain value. 

Paula: Yes. Yes.

Joyce: So that’s why I think an interesting example. 

Paula: Wonderful. 

Joyce: I think it’s the future somewhere for loyalty.

Paula: Yes. I agree.

Joyce: I need it for experience.

Paula: Yeah. Somewhere being the operative word, cause I think we’re all still figuring it out. I think somebody like Armin, then if he is one of the best DJs in the world, forgive me, I don’t tend to follow music, certainly no. DJs, but we will make sure to link to the Armin’s All Access  in our show notes with your help just to make sure that we can absolutely give people an opportunity to access this particular community.

I loved what you commented actually about joy, specifically that there’s a three year plan. Is that something that the fans who are clearly paying, as you said, for this community access, they had visibility by the sounds of it, of what the three year plan was going to be?

Joyce: Yeah. Yes, the actual roadmaps on the yeah, on the pages where you can find the next steps.

Paula: So I like that. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. It’s almost like, teasing, exciting, building momentum and keeping people engaged, as you said, because yeah, I really feel like certainly when I was running programs early in my career, I always felt like it just had a three year lifespan. You know, there was chaos beforehand, then you launch actually, then the hard work actually starts. And then three years later, everybody’s moved on to something else in the business. And you’re still trying to keep the, keep everybody focused, huh?

Joyce: Yes, indeed.

Paula: Wonderful. Great. Well, it’s an amazing example. And I think we talked to you before we, we started recording about the values of this show and we do very much focus on things like innovation. So I think that’s a, an excellent example, Joyce, to kick us off. 

So, as I said, we’re here to talk about Club Pathé and I think it would be remiss if I didn’t first of all ask you to introduce the brand so the cinema group itself, and then of course your own background, your professional career and how you ended up as the loyalty manager. So, would you mind just introducing Pathé Theatres for our audience? 

Joyce: Yes. Yes. Lovely. Okay, so, Pathé is a French international cinema operator. With about 127 cinemas in France, Netherlands, Swiss, Belgium and Tunisia and in almost all countries, we are market leader. And in 1896 or so, the company was started by the Pathe brothers. And their vision we actually use still, it’s sharing the wonderful world of film with as many people as possible. And it’s integrated in our current purpose and creating cinema memories together. 

Paula: Oh, beautiful. Yeah. 

Joyce: Why I say it’s linked to our vision of the loyalty program as well, of course.

Paula: Indeed. Okay. Well, love that. Of course. And the business strategy and the loyalty strategy are aligned. So music to our ears. And specifically in the Netherlands, Joyce, I know you’re based there in the Netherlands. How big is the Pathé Theatre operation in the country? I think you’re leading purely for the Netherlands. Am I right? 

Joyce: Yeah. Correct. 

Paula: Okay. Yeah. Okay.

Joyce: And in the Netherlands we have 30 theaters. 

Paula: 30 theaters. Okay. Wonderful. Great. And then tell us about you. How did you end up in this wonderful role? 

Joyce: Yeah, for I’ve been responsible for the loyalty activities for six years. And I’ve started my career in actually management consulting. 

Paula: Oh, cool. 

Joyce: Entertainment industry somewhere in various marketing positions. And after I set up a marketing team at your broadcasting, I found out that I actually wanted to be more specialized. And through a former colleague, I could start at to set up the loyalty there. And it was so exciting because everything related to loyalty was, could be developed. Like the company culture more customer minded strategy concerning customer centricity. A digital vision, a CX program. So, and that’s what I love about loyalty. It’s more than a program. 

Paula: Yes, it is.

Joyce: So, I fell in love with the industry ever since. 

Paula: Oh, like so many of us, Joyce. Yeah, it is wonderful. I think we, we are a, certainly a community of very passionate people. So, and so delighted to hear that coming through in your own role. So I guess the next logical question is what did you do when you got in with this blank canvas?

It’s an amazing opportunity to create a loyalty strategy to build something. So take us back to the beginning in terms of what did you do for the for the cinema chain when you had that blank sheet of paper? 

Joyce: Yes, sure. Well, we launched a reward program in 2019 called Pathé All Stars. And it’s a reward, a layered reward program. And the basic is point based. So, redeem your stars for discounts on special merchandising, tickets snacks and drinks. And besides the earn and burn principle, we also offer fun challenges. Think of simple challenges like the midweek mania fisting during off peak moments will reward you without your extra points for example.

Back then the program was already more than just discounts. We surprised members with special benefits like access to a special opening nights, a chance to become an extra in the movie. And yeah, we invite them for exclusive events, created special competitions experimenting a little bit with with badges and gamification already. Yeah, actually we received the two loyalty awards in a year later. 

Paula: Yes. Incredible. So yes, I wanted to specifically comment on that. So, so you did enter The International Loyalty Awards. Of course, I’m a big fan and a big supporter of those. And while I think of it, if anybody is thinking about entering the 2024 International Loyalty Awards and listening to this, it is closing for entries quite soon on the 1st of February.

So I think it’s a perfect advice actually from Joyce to really, I suppose, get the recognition that your hard work paid off. Deserve. So, so I think you won, if I’m not mistaken, best customer experience and then best use of social and mobile back in 2020, Joyce. So that was incredible for the first version of the program.

So it’s obviously grown tremendously. How did it perform for you as a business given all of the accolades? You know, and again, it was the first program that you had in place. How did it work for you? 

Joyce: At that time, we were, of course, very proud of what we achieved, but it was still too transactional and individual oriented, and there was not an integrated approach.

For example, we had another form of loyalty was already there in, in form of our subscriptions. And so we have the regular accounts where you had to opt in for All Stars, the reward program, and we had separate the subscription. So it was very unclear for visitors. Because they thought they’re already in the program if they had an account or they thought it was a paid one because they thought of the subscriptions. So that’s why we kept on developing the program further. 

And in September last year, we launched Club Pathe with the primary goal to integrate all loyalty activities. To create a community feeling where all movie lovers can experience movie. And it works together. 

Paula: Amazing. So yeah, September, 2023, in case people are listening to this in years to come. So you launched Club Pathé, September, 2023. That’s always brilliant just to kind of put a marker in for people listening at different times. So, so thank you for indulging me on that piece. 

So what kind of market trends then? You’ve talked about integration and clearly, I mean even as we said, you know, three years ago, Joyce, you know, I was reading a wonderful article, which our friend from Currency Alliance, actually Chuck published a wonderful review. He was very closely involved, I know, with The International Loyalty Awards at the time. And he literally described your first program as all singing, all dancing, digital loyalty ecosystem. And he really said you know, in fact, it was the most integrated program already that they’d ever seen. And here you are taking that again to the next level.

So talk us through maybe some of the market trends or opportunities that you felt, you know, would help you again, elevate from already the, you know, Pathé Rewards program, as you said, into Club Pathé and where we are today. 

Joyce: Yeah. Well, if you are in the business there, we talk about emotional loyalty for years now, and we take an actual steps to shift from the transactional to a more emotional based and togetherness.

So we focus more on for example, special member nights, more on gamification elements where you play quizzes together or do a spin and win. And the most important one is that the togetherness can be found in the new subscriptions as well. Where we created add-ons where you can easily add someone to your subscription to go together.

Paula: Nice. 

Joyce: Yeah, so, and I’ve saw, seen the transfer this year that subscriptions is also an interesting shift. So that element we, yeah we’ve integrated. It’s it feels like a premium model somewhere. So okay. It’s still a free, easy, approachable personalized reward program, but members are enticed to to subscribe for one of our bundles and extras.

Paula: Amazing. Yeah.

Joyce: To provide a movie experience and valuable memories together. 

Paula: Yeah, of course. Yeah. And what I, you know, ended up feeling, which I really loved from the briefing document that you sent over to me, Joyce, was this idea of creating an umbrella brand. As you said, there was a whole digital ecosystem. So all of the pieces of the puzzle were there, but it sounded like there was some kind of, you know, lack of clarity with the cinema goers who didn’t quite know what fitted in your, as you said, freemium model, which already existed or what belonged in the in the reward side. So now your Club Pathe essentially packages it all together and people can pick and choose exactly what they need. 

Joyce: Yes, exactly. 

Paula: Yeah. Good. Okay. Super clear. So how’s it going? 

Joyce: Actually very good. The whole concepts of the new subscriptions which we’re integrating it’s very clear for visitors and also for our NPS, because we’re, yeah. It’s difficult if you change existing elements into new ones. Yeah, and the concept of the subscriptions we offer bundles that are based on needs of different target groups. So it’s not the good, better, best approach that we.

Paula: Yeah, might have seen in the past.

Joyce: It’s important to recognize different segments of fans. And it’s actually good that we yeah, we get feedback on a lot of new ideas for concept of bundles or add ons from our visitors as well. So that’s exciting.

Paula: Amazing. Am I right in, in, I suppose, as well as the integrating piece as well, Joyce? You know, one of the kind of key things that you saw an opportunity around was this idea of community. And I do think it’s fair to say that most people going to the cinema probably prefer to go with a friend or family member.

But it’s almost like you’re taking it to the next level of wanting them to feel like they’re belonging to, you know, other people who love films, you know, with all of the possibilities, actually, my mind is already racing ahead to what you could do with that, but that feels like a very important part of the positioning.

Joyce: Yes, that’s correct. Lovely that you summarized it.

Paula: Well, you know, it’s all coming from your own document, Joyce. And if it’s okay with you what I’d love to do is make sure that. Anybody who wants to reach out and maybe gets, you know, this document from us, if it’s okay that we could share it. Because I think it takes, you know, with nothing confidential in it, but a very clear, I suppose, strategy document to explain, you know, the starting point, some of the business needs, your thinking that came through and the evolution that resulted.

Joyce: Yeah. I don’t care.

Paula: Okay. Okay. Any statistics you can share? Any numbers? I know sometimes they’re commercially sensitive, but if you have some that can tell us exactly what’s what’s been delivered just in the short three months that you’ve had Club Pathe going. 

Joyce: Yeah, I can share something for some of the free memberships, we are around 2.1 million members. 

Paula: Wow.

Joyce:And I think that the interesting part is how active are the member is the member base. And 45% is active in the last 12 months. So I think that’s a pretty good job. We do there. 

Paula: Amazing. 

Joyce: And we saw also an increase the paid members. I will not share the whole database of the paid membership, but we around 20,000 new paid members in the last three months. 

Paula: Wow, that’s great. 

Joyce: It’s 22 percent with an add-on. So that’s also yeah. Taking off. 

Paula: Super interesting. Yeah, I don’t know about you and you know, clearly you’re in the industry where I’m outside and watching, but what I’m noticing or hearing is that there is a renewed love of cinema, actually, as an experience, despite the growth of giants, like all of the streaming services that I’m, you know, very aware and I’m sure you’re even more, you know, potentially concerned about. But it does feel like that there’s almost a backlash to the fact that we’ve only been sitting at home, perhaps during some difficult years.

But I know Pathé Theatres has been growing. I think I saw that you guys have had the best year since I think 2016. So it feels like there is this resurgence of interest in the big screen. 

Joyce: Yeah. I think the ticket sales hasn’t reached the pre COVID levels. And the difficulty is that blockbusters become an exception. We’ve seen a dependence of blockbusters on the success of Barbie and Oppenheimer. But, yeah, we actually see indeed an uplift. People seem to have found the routine again, the way back to the cinemas. With the success, for example, of yeah Barbie and Oppenheimer. 

But what’s also important is that Pathé is an innovative company. We don’t just sit and wait. And we’re also working on other initiatives to get people to the cinema. For example, gaming, to integrate in the whole experience. 

Paula: Can you explain that a little bit more? What do you mean by gaming? 

Joyce: We have cooperation with gaming experts and you actually can game in a number of theaters before or after you’ve seen a movie, for example, with the newest games, newest technologies that you can use and you can actually extend your cinema visits in Pathe.

Paula: Interesting. 

Joyce: So that’s one initiative and more will soon follow.

Paula: Oh very, very intriguing. Yeah. But I like that. I like the way you describe, Joyce, that people are finding their way back to the habit. And it sounds like that, of course, was always the intention perhaps for the subscription model.

As you said, it needed to be repositioned and clarified in terms of exactly how it, it was fitting in with the Pathé Rewards. So would you mind telling us about the rewards, then, strategy and structure as it stands? I loved the fact that you mentioned, you know, particularly the opportunity to become an extra. I do have a sister back home in Ireland who’s really passionate about being an extra in some of the productions that are filmed in Ireland. So I think it’s something that most people don’t even realize is something actually that film producers do need people to join and sometimes be on set. So even that piece is very innovative. 

Joyce: Yes. And it’s exciting to work together with with your partner. So the distributors the producers, but also with our F& B partners. For example, in the Netherlands there’s a national popcorn day coming ahead and we do a lovely quiz and you can win a year of free popcorn.

Paula: Okay. That sounds like it’s bad for my tummy, but good for my I don’t know what interest and excitement about going to the theater. That’s really cool. Yeah.

Joyce: Another example is we just had a chance to win a trip to Paris when you see a movie, which takes place in Paris. 

Paula: Interesting.

Joyce: So that’s also an example and yeah, about the whole community feeling we have a challenge to visit all different pet theaters and receive a special pin like collectible that you can receive if you completed that challenge altogether. So. 

Paula: Lovely. Yeah, it’s a very exciting. Yeah. Yeah. As you said, keeping people engaged, keeping them excited and going beyond, you know, the simple movie experience to add and layer in over and above that. 

The other piece I wanted to ask you about Joyce again, coming back to Chuck’s article on LinkedIn, which I’ll make sure I link to as well for people who wanted to look back to your awards, but he used another strong word, which was wonderful. And very topical, I think just coming into early 2024. A lot of us are talking about the employee involvement, and he just said there was a master stroke which involved including the employees in the design of the program. And then I think you also had a quite significant measurement and monitoring of which theaters were performing well in terms of driving your loyalty initiative.

So anything you can share in terms of how the employees of Pathé Theatre do embrace the program, because what I sometimes feel in different industries is and there could be, I guess, this risk, I guess, for you with the cinema as well is, you have pressure points where everybody’s trying to get into the cinema, you know, in a short time window.

So, you know, things like registering somebody for a loyalty program might feel like it’s a distraction if it’s required at the point of which they’re maybe buying their tickets. But anything you can share about the employee involvement, either at the beginning or at this stage would be very interesting.

Joyce: Investment in employees and how they learn and get excited about the program is always been yeah, an important point for us. So, from the beginning on, we had special workshops with our employees to, yeah to keep them aligned in the way we created the program. 

And we also had a special contents and ID boxes how to create challenges or which a merchandise item we should develop. So we really yeah we’re trying to get them excited about the program even before the launch. So they feel they felt a part of it already.

Paula: Lovely. 

Joyce: And at the launch and we did also at the launch we did in September last year is we had an influencer we used in in our socials as well. And the influencer recorded a nice video for our visitors, but also for a special one for internal use. 

Paula: Oh, nice. Yeah.

Joyce: With lot, lots of explanation of course, but also with the special challenges the employees could do these theaters. Oh. So that’s very exciting. And they if they completed challenges that they could win bien burgers evening or pizza nights or lots of things that they could win with or, with their colleagues. So that was a great way to engage them. 

Paula: Wonderful. Okay. So it sounds like they’ve responded very well for you. 

Joyce: Yes. Yes, indeed. Yeah. They were very yeah to work together. And the most important one is to actually get excited about the program and tell the visitors about it. That’s the only way that if they don’t hear it on through media or on the website, then you can actually yeah, promote it there. They’re real ambassadors.

Paula: Oh, wonderful. And I’m guessing Joyce, am I right in saying that what you hope they will do is encourage your visitors, your guests your viewers, I’m not sure your terminology in the industry, but they’re basically asking them to download the app.

So rather than saying, you know, join Club Pathé or buy a subscription or any of those other options, it is obviously a digital first ecosystem. So is that what they are asked to do is to encourage people to download the app and then, you know, engage in whatever way they see fit? 

Joyce: Not exactly. It can be one of the things that they yeah, it’s nice that they ask. But it’s more like the special benefits though. So because they are in contact with the visitor and they can really feel what what’s this visitor’s needs or benefits for them that can be a discount in the F& Bshop. They can, did you know that you can receive discounts on F&B? Or for example, if it’s a subscriber and our employees know exactly who’s visiting more often and who doesn’t, then the employee can say, well, maybe you want to visit our special member night next week or join us or share our your reviews or so. It was yeah, different benefits that they touched upon to, yeah, to create the visitors engagement and signing up.

And the more practical one is that they had to scan the cards, of course. So we can get the data. The most challenging part when we started was identifying individual visitors and connected transactions. So get to know them better and to give them a personalized experience. And we more and more digitalized with buying the tickets online, but we cannot link the transactions in the cinemas.

Paula: Okay, indeed. Yeah. And how do you keep them up to date, Joyce? Because I know it’s all, you know, wonderful and exciting at different times, you know, I think I said to you before we came on air, the whole piece around, you know, getting a program launched is always, you know, it feels like the peak experience for everybody, but I always feel that’s when the hard work really starts. So how do you keep them both up to date, aware, and I suppose excited about you know, sharing this with with your guests? 

Joyce: Yeah, we actually send a monthly email in where we share the results coming up new shop items or new challenges. And there is also a new challenge every month for the employees themselves. And we shared the winner of the previous challenge. 

Paula: Great. Okay. And those challenges are based on performance, are they? So they can see what the other theaters in different cities are doing in terms of whether it’s registrations or engagements or whatever the metrics are. So you publish that and they can see then how they’re doing compared to their colleagues. Yeah. 

Joyce: Yes. Yeah. Yes. They can see. And we try to pick one element or one KPI in every challenge. So it’s different. 

Paula: Okay. Nice. So keep them on their toes, huh? 

Joyce: Yes, exactly. 

Paula: Amazing. Great. Great. I’ll be keen to talk in a second now, Joyce, about the future focus as we I suppose we’re already coming to the end of the first month of 2024, which is kind of mad.

But the other piece I just wanted to briefly touch on, which I just saw on your website, it’s not specific to loyalty, but it’s a pet favorite of mine when there’s clever copywriting. And I just saw this idea, which I think is just gift cards. You can correct me if I’m wrong, but it was just described as give the gift of goosebumps. And I just thought that was very clever. A very, you know, intelligent way to connect with the ultimate experience that you’re trying to create a cinema operators. So yeah, just wanted to acknowledge that I think copywriting has a role to play in driving loyalty or for people like me to go, yes, I want to give the gift of goosebumps. I thought that was super cool. 

Joyce: Yeah. Thanks. Yeah. That’s a more emotional than than just the functional benefits of a gift card. 

Paula: Totally. Totally. Yeah. Well, you got me. So that was super cool. So listen, then what is coming in the future for 2024 Joyce? 

Joyce: Yeah, we just launched the MVP. So, we had a lot of wishes for the future. 

Paula: Okay. Always. 

Joyce: Yeah, of course. We’re not only develop more personalized proposition getting more and more grip on data because that’s yeah. But also expanding the best way to expand the community feeling maybe create our own community or integrate it with existing communities.

For instance, native or Reddit or or a pilot in Discord. Yes. Yeah. So yeah, exciting things that we can touch upon. And yeah, we actually built the subscriptions like bundles and extras very flexible. So based on the data we can yeah, we can see if it’s the subscription model and we find the offering better to meet the user demands.

Paula: Amazing. Yeah. Yeah. And I guess, of course, as you said, if you’ve got your MVP so it’s still very early days, but I guess the key is the retention piece, of course, for a subscription model. So I’m sure people could potentially churn, but it’s unlikely at this very early stage, if they’ve signed up, that they would discontinue. But I guess that’s something that most subscription programs as they mature have to have more and more of a focus on. So I’ve no doubt you’ll be creating very innovative ideas to both measure, monitor and and reduce the churn of course to make sure that you keep those subscribers once you’ve got them engaged and signed up. So very exciting times ahead. 

Joyce: Yes, indeed. Yeah. 

Paula: Wonderful. Okay, so you’ll have to keep us up to date, Joyce. That’s always the thing I find when I have these conversations. It feels like the start of an ongoing conversation where the audience is always going to be really thrilled to follow you and your work.

So, with that said, I’d love to link to your LinkedIn profile just in our show notes for anybody who does want to reach out and connect. I can see you’re nodding, so thank you for that. I think it’s always really exciting as loyalty professionals. To your exact point, we all feel, I guess, well, I certainly always felt very lonely as a loyalty program operator. And if I could talk to somebody else and reach out on a topic that interests me, that was always very welcome. So thank you for facilitating any of those kind of connections. 

Joyce: Yeah. Sure.

Paula: So that’s all I have to ask today, Joyce. Is there any other final thoughts or comments or words of wisdom that you wanted to share with our global audience before we wrap up?

Joyce: Yeah, maybe this is a moment where I can thank the whole team, the colleagues who we’ve been working with together, because.

Paula: Beautiful. 

Joyce: Yeah. The, you have to have a great team to create the way. Yeah.

Paula: Indeed. It takes a village, huh? 

Joyce: Yes, indeed. And I’m also very proud of the board who’s given the confidence to build things as well into experiment. 

Paula: Yes, lovely. 

Joyce: So thank you.

Paula: Yes, Indeed. Yeah. So well done. Absolutely. No, we’ve often said on the show, Joyce, that, you know, it does come from the vision at the very top. And I know it is a very mature company in terms of how long it’s been in business. But it does take a lot of as you said, vision and wisdom to continue investing, particularly in projects like this, which are, you know, affecting the whole business are technically sometimes quite complex. So I know you were quite pleased that it all went well, technically which is always a relief because you never quite know until you press the go live button.

So yeah. So listen, it’s been really interesting Joyce. I do hope, as I said, that you’ll come back up on the show in the months and years to come. So literally want to say. Joyce Mense, Loyalty Manager for Pathé Theatres. Thank you so much from Let’s Talk Loyalty. 

Joyce: Thanks. Thanks for having me.

Paula: Thank you so much for listening to this episode of Let’s Talk Loyalty. If you’d like us to send you the latest shows each week, simply sign up for the Let’s Talk Loyalty newsletter on letstalkloyalty.com. And we’ll send our best episodes straight to your inbox. And don’t forget that you can follow Let’s Talk Loyalty on any of your favorite podcast platforms. And of course, we’d love for you to share your feedback and reviews. Thanks again for supporting the show.