Paula: Welcome to Let’s Talk Loyalty, an industry podcast for loyalty marketing professionals. I’m Paula Thomas, the Founder and CEO of Let’s Talk Loyalty and also now Loyalty TV. Today’s episode is hosted by Charlie Hills, Chief Strategy Officer of Mando-Connect, a UK based agency that uses smart data to create brilliant partnerships and rewards that really work.
If you work in loyalty marketing, you can watch our latest video interviews every Thursday on www.loyalty.tv. And of course, you can also listen to Let’s Talk Loyalty every Tuesday, every Wednesday, and every Thursday, to learn the latest ideas from loyalty experts around the world.
Charlie: Hello, and welcome to Let’s Talk Loyalty. I’m Charlie Hills, the Chief Strategy Officer for Mando-Connect, WPP’s loyalty specialist partnerships and rewards agency. In this episode, I’m delighted to be interviewing Richard Long, based out of Chicago. Rich has significant cross sector loyalty experience working for global brands, including PepsiCo and McDonald’s and US brands like Allstate and U.S. cellular, and also a wide range of other brands that span many industries while serving as a consultant. Today, we’ll be learning about his favorite loyalty programs, the highlights and key learnings from the programs he’s worked on, and what he sees as the most interesting trends in loyalty. I hope you enjoy our conversation today.
So, hello, Rich. We are absolutely delighted to have you on Let’s Talk Loyalty today. Welcome to the podcast.
Rich Long: Thank you, Charlie. Great to be here.
Charlie: Oh, it’s so exciting when we get somebody with your portfolio of experience and all the different brands and sectors that you’ve worked on. I think this is going to be a really interesting episode, pulling out all those highlights and those key learnings as we go. But before we get into the detail of what you’ve worked on and all that brilliant experience that you’ve got, we always start every episode with Paula’s favorite question. So, Rich, without further ado, what is your favorite loyalty program?
Rich Long: So, as a longtime listener of the podcast, I knew this question was coming at me. And it’s not because I don’t want to answer your question, but because, one, there’s just not really one program out there that, that is just so part of my daily life that stands out and I just really can’t do without. And two, because I always, want to have my professional hat on and pick elements of some different ones out there that I like a lot.
So I want to mention just a few. So notone program, but kind of parts of multiple programs. So maybe it’s a new program. It kind of matches these all together. I don’t know what they would be called or what industry that would be in.
But in any event, what some of that come to mind are Sephora and how it creates that beauty insider feel positioning and how much of that is embedded throughout that entire Sephora customer experience.
Another one is Lego. I think they do a great job at building an insider community and also they have their play zone for games and more fun and stuff like that for their community.
And then programs that just make my travel that much easier and give more peace of mind, like Marriott or Hilton, with the ease of checking in and out through the app, or United or American Airlines with the flight and gate change alerts to partner benefits that are extended throughout that membership experience that although I think that some of those types of benefits and experiences these days are probably more table stakes for the travel hospitality industry.
Charlie: I think those are really good examples and actually three of my favorite sectors. So you’ve got the beauty, which I love. Everyone’s heard me talk a lot about a European brand and British brand that we’re talking about called Beauty Pie at the moment, who are really shaking up kind of beauty, loyalty and subscription. And who doesn’t love Sephora Beauty Insider?
Lego, awesome. I’ve got two teenage boys. It’s a huge part of our life and has been for years. And I love their relaunch program and then travel, of course, you know, one of the oldest kind of staple loyalty sectors that’s been really shaking things up. So it’s really cool programs pulled out there and I really like how you pulled out different kind of features as well.
Like how important ease is for the travel sector, probably less important for Lego actually play being called out there. So it’s a really nice way of thinking about programs and as they apply to the sector and the brand that they’re led with. So yeah, thank you. That’s a great answer. Although cheeky to get four in rather than one. I don’t know what Paula will think of that.
Rich Long: I try to break some of the rules there and got in four instead of one. So hopefully you and Paula will forgive me on that.
Charlie: I think she probably will. I’ll check with her later. I don’t, I know our listeners definitely. Well, and do check out all those programs, everyone. I’m sure you’re aware of at least some of them. There are some really big names there.
Talking of big names, obviously you’ve worked with a lot of big names, you know, household brands and household companies and sectors that we all sort of love and know, but that’s a little bit more about your background. You know, what drew you into loyalty marketing and what’s so interesting to you about this world that we operate in.
Rich Long: Sure. So at this point in my career, I feel that I’ve really established myself as a really good strategic customer loyalty professional that has always been driven by research data, consumer insights.
And I have a real customer obsession when it comes to creating and orchestrating and delivering successful, engaging programs that foster deep connections and enhance customer value. I really don’t know exactly kind of when that kind of began. Kind of, in my mind, but it feels like it’s my entire career has been kind of thinking and focused along those lines.
Also, I feel that I have a very strong, real broad, distinct perspective, having worked both in corporate consulting and agency environments and supporting many brands across all those many industries to look at business situations from all those different lenses while also representing the humanistic voice that consumer at all times to represent them as best as possible.
I do wish to make one key point, though, that I do find it truly remarkable, even today, and I’m sure not alone with a lot of your smart listeners out there, but it just seems common sense to me is that we’re all humans, we’re all consumers, we all live our lives in an industry and channel neutral, holistic world, yet sometimes that is not how brands go to the market to deliver on their customer member experience.
Charlie: Yeah, I think that’s a really interesting thing that we’ve seen in loyalty marketing. I think five years ago, the dominant discussions were around the technology capabilities or the data integration or actually the business case of the loyalty program. And increasingly we are seeing that voice of the consumer voice of the member coming through. And I agree with you. I think that should really be at the forefront.
Sometimes I wonder if we get too stuck in the weeds, you know, we work in it so much, we know it inside out. It’s actually quite hard to step back and see it from the point of view of the person who’s you know, rushing around the shops and trying to find the app on their phone and actually is more interested in what they’re buying and engaging with the loyalty UX.
You know, I think personally, I can sometimes be guilty of thinking that people are running into stores or into online digital experiences, thinking about their loyalty experience first before necessarily everything else that’s going on in their life.
Rich Long: And that’s exactly my point that we all kind of live those lives. We all go through those experiences. Yet, when it comes to us deciding how we want to create, say, a loyalty program we sometimes some people sometimes forget that.
Charlie: Yeah, no, I think that’s really key actually. And something that you can actually see is a really strong thread that runs through all your experience.
So let’s start with PepsiCo, you know, what are your highlights from your time at PepsiCo and loyalty? And what do you think our listeners is? should take away from this podcast about your experience there. What would you like to share?
Rich Long: So I was with PepsiCo for a little over a year, and I just left there very recently.
So I was part of a relatively new, but very small team whose mission was to help to lead the transformation for the entire PepsiCo enterprise into more of a DTC organization based on a strong belief that us being more of a DTC focused company would unlock new consumer and business benefits across the entire product portfolio.
And my area of focus in particular was on its global loyalty strategy and design and helping to build that mindset change. One highlight there, I was spearheading the training of our team all around CLMP and getting them certified, and I felt that was very important for everyone to have a strong loyalty foundation.
Another highlight was that added to that foundation was to deliver a comprehensive and end playbook that covered any and all aspects of loyalty from the program strategy and objectives to its operating model and evolution.
Another key learning. That I learned a part of CPG was that when you don’t own your own POS or really sell direct at all, it’s a big challenge in how you identify who your customers are. How do you connect with them? How do you build relationships with them? So there are some basic approaches out there, like using scanning or uploading shopping receipts, but some of that gets a little clunky for the customer to easily participate and engage in. So you have to be thinking about other methods as well.
Another lesson I realized was a big part of a massive global organization like PepsiCo, you not only need to contend with all the many different markets and their needs or challenges or opportunities, but also contend with all the many brands as well. Some of which are in some markets, but not in other markets and figure out. Help us to navigate a really complex matrix organization like that. So you focus your priorities and energy in all the right places.
Charlie: Yeah, I think that’s a really interesting reflection, actually, that we’ve had from a lot of kind of people who’ve come to talk to us on the podcast from big, complex global brands, actually.
That last point around internal stakeholder management being almost as important as external stakeholder management and how you manage that level of complexity. How did you manage those conversations with different teams and different markets globally? What sort of structures and processes did PepsiCo have in place for that?
Rich Long: Well, a lot of that is driven by kind of what are some of the overall, like, company wide, market priorities, brand priorities, and they need to filter that down a little more deeply into the markets, the brands and kind of what are their current situations where their opportunities come to their willingness to embark upon kind of this journey and to kind of place your bets of where to focus your energies 3rd and so on and trying to make sure you’re not spinning your wheels in working with others who really have no desire to kind of go along the DTC journey. So, it’s in order to identify who to work with 1st, 2nd, 3rd and so on and kind of prioritize along those lines.
Charlie: That’s a really nice point actually, ’cause presumably not every market has the same level of engagement. Not every stakeholder had the same level of understanding. And I think that is a nice thing, isn’t it, when you’re in such a huge organization like that importance of prioritization.
And what about the CLMP piece? You know, everyone again on the podcast has heard me talk about the Loyalty Academy, the various different kind of loyalty training providers that are coming out in the moment. Why was that so important at PepsiCo, you think, to get everyone that certified loyalty marketing professional status?
Rich Long: Well, I thought it was very important because that not everybody a part of our team, although we’re all focused on DTC and loyalty has the same kind of background understanding and experience when it comes to loyalty, even though we’re all focused on it.
So I felt it was just really important for all of us to get at least on the same page with regards to that loyalty foundation with that. But that good certification on all aspects of loyalty and then those people who have more experience can continue to accelerate kind of the learning and so on across the team, but others, they probably needed that boost to get that same be on the same level playing field with everyone else and help everyone to do their jobs that much better on a regular basis.
Charlie: Yeah, I think that probably helps with that third point as well about stakeholder management as well, because it gives you a level of credibility in the field as well, that certification, but really importantly, a common language to talk to people about, you know, customer value proposition, understanding what the mechanic is of the program, understanding what the rewards are and the different models that are out there.
Or yeah, I teach some modules on promotions and partnerships and sustainability for the Loyalty Academy. And I think that’s also really interesting because once you’ve got those fundamentals, you can start to think about innovations and how to do things differently and bring more value into the program and more engagement into the program.
What was your favorite bit, what was the favorite thing that stood out from you from the training?
Rich Long: I think it was just how everything is all interconnected. You can’t just look at like one, one chapter and another chapter and so on and think about it kind of, different stages but how they’re all intertwined that as you think about kind of the operational say readiness that you need to be thinking about that at the same time when you’re beginning to think about kind of some of that upfront strategy and so on, because really to be developing out like a really a strong strategy.
But if you’re not say technology ready or people ready to be able to build and deliver that strategy, then you’re not really going to get anywhere. So I think it’s very interesting how all of it is so interconnected. You need to be thinking about it. It’s not like a linear a linear process where you’re just thinking about the 1st thing and then, okay, now I can move on to the 2nd part. You have to be kind of thinking kind of long term and all the implications and all the different situations as you’re focused on one particular area.
Charlie: Yeah, I think that’s always really interesting. One of my favorite things in that, of course, as well as they talk about starting with the end in mind, you know, actually, you’ve got to plan how you would close the program down before you’ve even launched the program should you need to.
And I think that long term thinking is so important in loyalty and thinking of all the different scenarios that might come up. And actually, is your program flexible and fit for purpose? And can it be as agile as businesses need programs to be in these challenging times?
Rich Long: Yeah, I definitely do remember that from the training where we are talking about, okay, how you close down the program? I’m kind of thinking, wow, this kind of it’s a little bit of a buzzkill for our training here. We’re already talking about how we’re going to close it down before we’re figuring out how we’re going to start it up. But I think, yeah, you are exactly correct where you need to be thinking about kind of the long term, the end result and all that as you’re thinking about it from the beginning at the same time.
Charlie: Yeah. And I think, you know, PepsiCo is a business that’s notorious and well known in the industry for its brilliant sort of planning and marketing processes. So really nice to have seen that from the inside.
I think one of the other best in, you know, best brands in the world that I think recognize for its planning and operations is McDonald’s. And you’ve had the privilege to work in loyalty at McDonald’s as well. You know, tell us about that tiny brand. Share with our listeners what loyalty looks like at McDonald’s and what on earth must that have been like to launch it globally? What sets it The Golden Arches approach to loyalty, you know, apart from the rest, how did, where did you even begin?
Rich Long: Yeah. So, yeah. So that was actually a very exciting exciting point in my career. So first I do not want to repeat many of the same things that were covered on a podcast last year between Paula and my former leader there, but I just as a quick refresher, I can repeat some of that information.
We essentially created the loyalty McDonald’s to solve a few big goals. One of the primary challenges we need to solve was essentially all the approximately 60 to 65 million daily transactions back at that time were anonymous, meaning we didn’t know who those customers were and we couldn’t ID who they were so that was a key reason we develop loyalty and it being app only program. That was why we went about that approach. The app itself prior to Loyalty was a little more than a digital deals and some other content, and few really used the app itself. But by building McDonald’s, by McDonald’s Rewards Loyalty directly into the app, it all of a sudden became very sticky, enabled incredible frequent engagement, which was also key for McDonald’s digital transformation that was underway.
Another reason for Loyalty McDonald’s was that we wanted another lever besides only deals and discounts to pull for us not to only gain incrementality, but incremental profitable customer value at the same time. And on that point, loyalty needed to drive incremental business through value and excitement.
And from what I’ve read recently, back in 2023, system sales to loyalty members across McDonald’s, 50 plus markets mounted to more than like 20 billion for the full year with about 6 million generated just the 4th quarter of last year. And globally, I know they’ve seen like a 30 percent increase in digital sales from what I’ve been reading since the launch of its loyalty programs.
And it’s just really played a really critical, crucial role in its transformation. Today, I think they have about 150 million, 90 day active members and active is really important there. So, I guess, in my humble opinion, I guess, what sets McDonald’s apart was that it seamlessly blended global efficiencies and consistency with local relevance to unlock significant business value and allow them to know who their customers actually are and not the merely being represented by a transactional stat or number in order for McDonald’s to enable so much more opportunity for the future. That was not possible before loyalty.
Charlie: Yeah. And I can only imagine how the CMOs globally must be feeling about that data set. Now, you know, they can understand people’s patterns. They can see, you know, who’s buying breakfast and then who’s buying lunch and how people are coming in groups. It must be the power of that data alone must be such a huge driver, let alone the uplift in sales and the kind of, you know, the digital consumption.
It’s such a great program. I love it. And we use it for delivery in the UK. I’m not sure if that’s in every market, but it’s. It’s a brilliant proposition and how exciting to work on something, you know, that iconic from a brand like that. I don’t think 10 years ago anyone would have thought McDonald’s ever would have done a loyalty program but now they have and how successful it’s been.
What do you think some of those big lessons are for our listeners from that loyalty at McDonald’s time that you spent?
Rich Long: So in terms of some key lessons learned, and I first need to make the point that I fully acknowledge that not every brand has maybe the same size, the global scale, or business model as McDonald’s.
I also fully realize that a lot of what I’m sharing today may not be anything all that new that your listeners don’t already know. However, I thought hearing some from my experiences and learnings, they only reinforce what many people may already know out there, or what they’re already doing or planning, no matter what your brand is.
So some big lessons for McDonald’s. So, from a global standpoint, a key thing is just no unicorns. And what that means is, we want to maintain a global brand and construct consistency and leverage technology to maintain economies of scale, and last but not least, ensure overall financial ability. We were not trying to build a different program in every market. One size does not fit all.
And that brings me to another lesson. So we followed a freedom within a framework approach where we built that one global framework. For all markets to use as its starting point. So that doesn’t mean that all 1 size fits all. But what that does mean is that all markets use that as their starting point that gave them the flexibility to then make it their own program, their own local program as they see fit.
So, as an example, we provided global guidance and recommendations on the redemption rewards menu. So, the number of levels number of products per tier for what people can redeem their points for. In order to determine what the product mix is that work best for them economically and was attainable. So each market could choose what worked best for them and figure out what is most attainable, valuable and compelling to their customers. So, of all the 50 plus markets out there who had loyalty and when I left that no 2 markets actually had the same rewards menu. So every market had that flexibility to localize and determine what is the right rewards redemption menu that fit and work best for them.
So another lesson was that your customers are just critical to your success. And I don’t mean, just thinking about the member end user for McDonald’s for about 90 plus percent of the restaurants globally are franchise owned. And in the way that loyalty was designed, it absolutely had to work economically for all of them.
But also part of the success is the crew itself that and I’m not, I’m talking about the people who are on the front lines and people had the most contact with the customer. So with the crew, they needed to not just understand how the program worked, but we wanted them to love the program. So it didn’t just need to work for them, but we really wanted them to be fans of the program and demonstrate that love. Day in day out. So even though the audience knows this, I can’t reinforce this enough for what it takes for a program to be successful.
All the best program planning mechanics completely can begin to erode when a customer comes to the front counter or pulls up to the driver and says, Hey, I’m a loyalty member. They see the crew person kind of rolling their eyes or the sense that they don’t have that same sentiment that of love and fun and joy of the program that they can kind of sense that through that drive through speaker as an example.
Final lesson is I don’t want to ever lose sight of what the business and people shouldn’t ever lose sight of the business outcomes you’re ultimately trying to achieve as you’re planning your program. We didn’t want to be kind of overengineering our program and kind of lose sight of the fact that like at the end of the day, we’re just trying to sell more Big Macs and fries. And so we just wanted to make sure that we always kept that in mind and we didn’t get too ahead of ourselves and building a great, aging loyalty program and forget what we’re ultimately trying to achieve there.
Charlie: Yeah, I think that’s really nice. That kind of that brand and business mantra really runs through that program and you can see it in the simplicity of the execution and then the little bits of fun that they bring in, but it’s quite a simple program actually. And that plays to the, you know, the strengths of the fast food restaurant.
And as you say, it just helps people want more burger and fries. That’s great. That’s four really great lessons for our listeners actually. So no, you’re cool. Freedom in a framework, customers are critical to your success and don’t ever lose sight of those business outcomes. So, four really great lessons from your time at McDonald’s. Thank you very much for sharing.
Going even further back, you know, when we were talking about your brilliant history across different sectors, you know, it hasn’t just been FMCG and fast food, you know, what kind of key learnings have you got from your time at Allstate Rewards and your time at U.S. Cellular as well. Can you think back?
Rich Long: Sure. So probably some of your global listeners may not be aware of the Allstate brand, let alone that they even had a loyalty program. The first thing I will say is that we created a program, Allstate Rewards to create customer engagement and brand consideration for probably one of the most unengaging kind of industries out there around insurance and that no one really wants to have a relationship with their insurance carrier and they’re only probably very infrequent interactions. They do have are probably going to be negative in nature. Anyways, like, filing a claim or paying a bill.
So without getting into more details of the program itself, but we’re able to deliver a really successfully engaging program, but some of the lessons learned there is that consider kind of the entire brand experience when focusing on the member experience. So what I mean here is that, for instance, we never want to send out a member communication when being completely caught off guard or unaware that the person just had probably a very horrendous, maybe recent experience.
And we’re dealing with our customer support center, probably very recently and invented to them and who knows if the issue is even resolved or not that you need to be aware of things like that. So you don’t want to innocently like send out what might, what you might thought was a real targeted. Effective personalized message and not realize like, like that situation is currently going on with that customer or just recently has not acknowledged that or be aware. So I would say that makes us look, I’ll roll pretty stupid or disconnected and kind of hurt any sense of brand loyalty when you’re not even kind of aware, let alone kind of managing to some of those situations you need to be familiar with.
That’s why I had not just regular calls with our Allstate contact center team, but also try to flag situations like that to better inform how we communicate best and most appropriately with all of our program members. And I thought that just connecting all those dots was very, very important, not just here at Allstate but also throughout my consulting career that even I probably wouldn’t even have thought about that or the importance of that.
If it wasn’t for even earlier back in my career, when I was a management consultant and working on a big call center analysis project, and I got to learn kind of the ins and outs around the contact center and kind of the call reasons and how you, how do you manage that and kind of the, all the, all that particular kind of project itself, but that kind of led me to like, think back to, that’s like a very key critical touch point that any customer or member will be having, and that really needs to be thought of and managed to when you think about your loyalty communications.
In terms of U.S. Cellular, probably not too many people out there are aware of that brand as well, even probably in the U.S. these days, because a lot of business was sold a few years back to a larger wireless carrier. But in leading their customer lifecycle management team and rewards program, a lesson learned there, pricing is pretty basic, but always think about your members customer loyalty journey between kind of the when they’re onboarding and engaging to reengaging to if you need to be winning them back as you’re targeting them and understand that only where they are on their journey, perhaps. Like, why? Why are they there on their journey? Are they stuck in that part of the journey? But it’s keeping them kind of there. How the best is to keep them active as you’re trying to keep them fully engaged and to grow their customer value. So, like, think about, like, where they are on that journey and, like, why they’re there. And that’s, where you want them to remain
Charlie: interesting. Yeah, it’s lovely looking back across those different sectors. I always think telco is a really interesting sector, particularly in the European market. Actually, it’s a really fiercely competitive sector. So it is one of the ones that we really look at actually for inspiration and new ideas. You’ve got some really big players in the British market doing very cool things.
What do you think of the sectors to watch and why? It’s interesting having worked across so many. Which are your favorites?
Rich Long: So I guess over my career, I mean, I’ve probably worked in like, like more than 10 different industry sectors. A lot of that driven from like, something half my career as a management consultant. But I guess, I guess to answer your question, I always felt that the sectors that include the ones experience is a part of them were probably the ones most important and had the most opportunity for loyalty professionals to influence it.
So whether it’s retail, hospitality, QSR versus more like product service sector areas where it might be a little more transactional in nature and really hard to change that to be less transactional. So I think that’s kind of more of a challenge in some of those industries. But again, where there’s that actual experience that you can really help to inform and shape and influence, I think has the biggest impacts.
Charlie: That’s nice. And that fits very naturally with your passion for, you know, creating human experience. Experiences and thinking always about the consumer. I guess it would make sense that those ones where it’s more of an experience are the ones that appeal to you the most? And what about ideas and innovations? Anything you’re particularly proud of or admire?
Rich Long: So I honestly don’t think I have anything new here to share with your listeners that you probably that they don’t already know or are fully aware of. But I would say that Some of the same things that probably people are already doing, thinking, saying, applying between the evolution to more kind of experiential, emotional loyalty from the transactional only programs, the gamification, social responsibility and cause related programs, the payments integration, the AI driven personalization, like all those things are some of those I don’t come just kind of like trends or new ideas, but I think those are kind of like becoming like, like, like building blocks that people need to be thinking about now because that’s how consumers are expecting.
Charlie: Yeah. And a really nice sort of build there in terms of thinking about that bigger picture as well in loyalty. I talk a lot about social responsibility and cause related and corporate social responsibility and loyalty and how programs nowadays not only have to adhere to a brand’s policy, but they have to sort of actively contribute.
So personally, I’m really pleased that’s in your list along with gamification as well, which, you know, again, I feel like we’ve been talking for a long time. It feels like it means something quite different in 2024 than it did, you know, 10 years ago.
What about some of the more challenging things? I think, you know, you’ve worked on some really big brands and some really complex businesses in all sorts of different sectors. What are some of the biggest loyalty challenges you’ve faced? And, you know, and how did you address it?
Rich Long: So I guess both for brand like, like PepsiCo and really, I should say their entire portfolio brands between Gatorade, Pepsi to Doritos, Captain Crunch and just many others to even a very well known brand as well. Like, like McDonald’s itself. But like who even owns their own POS and they have their own restaurants, but a big challenge is really trying to identify your customer actually is that and even once you do to learn who they are, not just as a transactional customer and looking at their transactional history and so on but who they are as humans, and there are many things underway at PepsiCo as well as what we were doing in McDonald’s to try to address that.
Another challenge is not just to become too focused on your programs, mechanics or unintentionally over engineer the member experience, but also keep in mind how your members minds work and again, back to how we’re all humans. We’re all consumers ourselves to be kind of having looking things through that lens at the same time. They never lose sight of that. So, like, during the planning stage, if you ever find yourself having to over explain certain things to one another, then your customers will just not get it at all. And you shouldn’t even be going in that direction.
Charlie: Yeah, I always think that’s a great acid test, isn’t it? Like, can you explain the program in a couple of sentences and how it works? And if you can’t, you’ve got a real problem. Actually, you’ve got to have something that people kind of instantly and intuitively get and can use. So yeah, I think that’s a really good couple of key challenges and key learnings there.
Rich Long: Yeah, and then otherwise that yeah, so, so you’re trying to explain it to one another and then someone has the idea, oh let’s create some really fantastic onboarding experience that would really help to explain how the program works. And this and that, and like, you’re already going down that path of it. It’s probably not that simple to understand. And now you’re just trying to create more, more tactics, in more procedures in order to make it seem that it is simple when it probably isn’t.
Charlie: Yeah, I think that’s so important, isn’t it? When we work in it, we understand all the details and all the workings of it. So taking that consumer point of view is always so key. Well, thank you. Those are brilliant answers to brilliant questions and really interesting kind of experiences there that you’ve shared, the positive and the negative. At this point, is there anything else you’d like to share with our listeners? Anything else you think we should cover?
Rich Long: So, I mean, honestly, I think we’ve pretty much hit like all the key points. And again, I don’t want to kind of minimize that people out there that they’ve heard a lot of like earth shattering things here at all, but hopefully just helps to kind of validate reinforce a lot of what they already know is some of these kind of real examples that I shared.
Charlie: Well, that’s great. I’m sure they’ll feel the same way. And if any of them have any questions or anything else, they’d really like to follow up with you on what’s the best way of them reaching you.
Rich Long: So, of course, I’m always very happy to talk with anyone who reaches out probably the best way is to connect with me. If we’re not already on LinkedIn. And I’m sure you’ll also be putting some of my contact information in the podcast show notes as well.
Charlie: Yeah, absolutely. We’ll cover off all your profile and where people can get in touch to find out more about some of those brilliant brands you’ve worked on.
Well, look, thank you so much. That was another great episode. And we really appreciate your time and sharing that expertise. Thank you very much. That’ll be goodbye from Let’s Talk Loyalty.
Rich Long: Thank you, Charlie.
Paula: Thank you so much for listening to this episode of Let’s Talk Loyalty. If you’d like us to send you the latest shows each week, simply sign up for the Let’s Talk Loyalty newsletter on letstalkloyalty. com and we’ll send our best episodes straight to your inbox. And don’t forget that you can follow Let’s Talk Loyalty on any of your favorite podcast platforms. And of course, we’d love for you to share your feedback and reviews. Thanks again for supporting the show.
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