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Hello, and welcome to today’s episode with the Alshaya Group, which is a dynamic family owned enterprise first established in Kuwait in 1890. Alshaya Group is now one of the world’s leading brand franchise operators with thousands of stores, cafes, restaurants and leisure destinations across the Middle East and North Africa, Russia, Turkey and Europe, as well as a growing online and digital business, featuring a total of 70 brands, including such iconic names as Starbucks, H&M, The Cheesecake Factory and Boots. The loyalty brand that powers this incredible retail network is a digital program called Aura which this year won the 2024 International Loyalty Award for Best Loyalty Program in the Retail Sector.
Joining us today are two of the leaders of that loyalty business. Nida Unas is the Director of Loyalty and Joanna Witsch is the Head of the Loyalty Product and Operations for the Alshaya Group and the Aura Program. I hope you enjoy our conversation.
Welcome to Let’s Talk Loyalty and Loyalty TV. This is long overdue, Nida, we’ve had you on the show once before.
Nida: Yes.
Paula: Joanna, it is definitely a conversation that I’ve been dying to have for an awful long time based on the incredible work that you’re both doing together.
Nida: Thank you.
Joanna: Thank you.
Paula: So, yeah, so welcome. It’s our first time in this new studio, so we’re all just settling in but we’re together in Dubai, so it’s absolutely amazing for us to have the opportunity to sit down and talk loyalty and pretend there’s no cameras.
Joanna: Amazing.
Paula: So as you both know, we always start this show trying to get an understanding of what you admire as loyalty professionals because that gives us things to look to in terms of best practice and excellence.
So Nida, I’m going to come to you first and foremost, will you please tell our audience what is your favorite loyalty program?
Nida: I can’t name the brand I work for.
Paula: No, absolutely not.
Nida: It’s Skywards cause yeah, I mean, the experience that you have as a Skywards member just sets you apart from a non Skywards member. So I do love it.
Paula: Okay. Amazing. Yes. We’ve had Emirates on the show a couple of times, as I’m sure you know, and absolutely Skywards. Last time I checked, I think it was over 35 million. We were talking numbers recently, but certainly I’m sure I’ll stand corrected now if that number has changed, but it’s incredible program.
Nida: Yeah.
Paula: I’m status chasing at the moment, actually, because I’m not good enough, not flying enough. And I really want to get back to gold now that.
Nida: I want to experience what it’s like to be an invite only member.
Paula: Ooh, okay. Well, you are the luxury.
Nida: Hard luck. Yeah.
Joanna: Lots of money to be spent.
Paula: Incredible. We have to have gold. So thank you for that. So shout out to Skywards. Absolutely. Thanks for that. And Joanna, then again, you’re in the industry a very long time. So what’s your current favorite loyalty program?
Joanna: I would say it’s Marriott Bonvoy for very similar reasons as Nida mentioned about Skyward. So you really feel, you know, being valuable customer and really, you know, value for money that you are getting from the program is really something that sets it apart. And, you know, the experiences you have out of it, it’s absolutely, outstanding in, from my point of view.
Paula: Totally. And I’ve said it on the show before Joanna, when I saw the co brand card actually that Marriott Bonvoy have here in Dubai, I literally signed up immediately. Yeah. I made my husband sign up and then I monitored his spending behavior until we got enough points to get into our favorite hotel. So there you go.
Joanna: Indeed. Indeed.
Paula: So really proves the point about how loyalty works. Yeah. which is obviously what we’re here to talk about. So let’s get into the conversation about Alshaya Group and Aura. It really is a beautiful story. As you know, we do have a global audience, so I thought the best place to start, and again, Nida, I’ll come to you, is would you mind just introducing the business for people who are not familiar with it?
Nida: Yeah, sure. Absolutely. Alshaya Group is a family owned business with home grounds in Kuwait. It has footprints across, you several markets internationally in Europe and more so with the dominant presence in the Middle East. It’s one of the largest retail franchise groups with over 70 plus brands, 70 plus amazing global brands in fashion, in apparel, in dining, hospitality, wellness, you name it. So it’s a large coalition of several brands that customers absolutely love in this region. And it really touches different aspects of customers lives.
Paula: Yeah.
Nida: We’ve got Boots, Mothercare, H&M, Starbucks, PF Changs, Cheesecake, you name it. So we really have a wide variety of brands, which makes it super interesting to have a loyalty program that caters for all these brands.
Paula: It does. Yeah. And I guess again for the global audience, it means it essentially operates like a coalition.
Nida: Yes, it does.
Paula: And I really think that’s incredibly valuable. I think it’s quite unique in this part of the world to have such broad family owned businesses, as you’ve talked about, and to have those incredible brands that everybody knows, operated by a brand that they may not know, like the actual family name itself. So thank you for explaining all of that. And then of course, Aura is the loyalty program.
Nida: So well, Alshaya Group being the B2B, you know, brand that brings all together. So the way we look at Aura is really the, you know, the consumer brand that the consumer interacts with and gives them experiences across these 70 plus brands.
So Aura is a loyalty program of Alshaya. It has 70 plus brands within Aura. It started not too long ago, so two and a half years ago. So it’s fairly a new program. And we operate in five markets of Alshaya in the Middle East, which really covers the core businesses of Alshaya Group.
And yeah, it’s done extremely well in the last two and a half years where, you know, we’ve grown really massively, the program’s loved by our customers, we’ve got 8.5 million members it’s gone on to win awards and the best part of it is that consumers love it. They commend it for its simplicity, for its ease of use, for the accessibility to such amazing brands. So yeah, a great story.
Paula: Amazing.
Nida: It is been a great story for Alshaya.
Paula: It is a great story. Absolutely. So, I mean, first of all, eight and a half million members. Congrats on that. I mean, that is a huge number in this part of the world, five countries, which also adds complexity as we know in terms of language, you know, currency. The, all of those variables that you’ve got to manage and then winning, literally, as you said, the International Loyalty Award for Best Loyalty Program Food, Retail, Non-food Retail. I mean, that is a global award. Yeah. I’m sure you put a load of work into it. So you must have been super proud when that came through.
Nida: Yeah. I mean, I stand, I sit here today, you know, representing the group, but there’s so many people who’ve worked so hard behind the scenes. And I think the most important stakeholder here is our store teams and our store colleagues, because they really sort of, you know, live and breathe Aura every single day.
Paula: Yeah.
Nida: The way they engage with the customers, the way that, you know, make that experience. Slightly better for the Aura members. Every single interaction is what sets Aura apart. As an organization, everybody owns a piece of Aura. And you really see that come through in how the program’s, you know, done so far and how it’s engaged with its customers. So yeah it’s a company-wide success, I would say. Yeah.
Paula: Amazing. Yeah. Yeah. And that’s exactly why we wanted to come together to hear about that journey. Two and a half years is not a lot of time for a project of this scale. And Joanna, I know you’ve been involved for the last, I think year and a half, correct. And I think initially focused on the app itself.
Joanna: Correct.
Paula: Yes. Which I know sounds like such a simple thing, but I think the whole audience listening knows that digitizing a program is a massive undertaking. So, tell us about your journey so far with Aura.
Joanna: Yes. So I joined in January last year and then the first task I’ve been given it was to launch a new Aura app. So we did have, you know, kind of legacy Aura app, which has, you know, had these basic functions, but what was important from the company perspective and as a loyalty team perspective was, you know, bring it in house so that we can really, you know, bring everything, all things Alshaya to Aura, right? So then, you know, that Aura and the Aura app specifically becomes this digital key of Alshaya, right? So, easier said than done, of course.
Paula: Totally.
Joanna: When I joined, you know, there was like, there was just a wish list of what we want to do. There were no requirements, no designs, the tech teams were waiting. So, yeah, it’s been a challenge from the very beginning, but we made it happen.
Paula: Yeah.
Joanna: And the new Aura app has been launched on the 22nd of July, which was absolutely amazing achievement to the big team behind the scenes. So it’s been, you know, the journey with ups and downs, obviously, but it’s been launched successfully. We have launched with the new features. So, you know, our customers can now enjoy so called mission offers. So we added, you know, more of a, engagement type of features for our customers. So it’s not just, you know, simple earn and burn type of a program.
Paula: Yeah. Yeah.
Joanna: We have added more possibilities in terms of communication with the customers. So, you know, we are now directly integrated with our marketing automation tool where we are having, you know, in app notifications based on the, you know, customer behavior, their interactions, push notifications. We can really now track properly the user’s behavior.
May sound silly, but yeah, in the previous app, our tracking was really not existent. So, you know, these are these things, which for some, I’m sure, you know, sound like, oh my gosh, guys, this should have been done a long time ago. But as you know, yes, program is just two and a half years old. So, you know, we just launched with what we had and then, you know, we got on the way to, to improve things.
So I’m really proud about that achievement. It’s a really good, great, great team effort. And it’s just the beginning, obviously for us, you know, we brought it in house so that can really, you know, grow it further. We can integrate more technologies, more platforms, more systems, more features into it.
Paula: Yeah. Even those technical decisions. I mean, I’ve often said it on the show. They kind of terrify me. I’ve never sat on the design side, you know, literally with that full responsibility and then sourcing the exact right solution. And we were down in South Africa, as I think, you know, last week and an awful lot of teams were talking about actually the certain parts they do want to do in house. And then of course there’s the main kind of points platform. So, so incredible what you’ve been doing.
And to me, that’s really like just getting the foundations right. You know, there’s so much more that we’re going to talk about actually that you are launching, but until you have that fundamental foundation, there’s no point focusing on anything else because we can all have the ideas. And I even remember actually Skywards, the guys were saying, there’s no shortage of wishes and ideas and dreams for loyalty.
Joanna: Never.
Paula: That’s not the problem. The problem is our resources and being able to deliver.
Joanna: Exactly. Our backlog has been growing since.
Paula: It’s never ending.
Joanna: Never ending.
Paula: It’s never ending. So, so you’ve got the app. It’s fully digitized. As you said, you had a legacy one and only eight weeks old by the sounds of it then. Just launched in July.
Joanna: Indeed. Indeed.
Paula: So incredible. The piece I really love, Joanna, that you told me about in preparation was the, I suppose the staff perspective need is already referred to, you know, that moment of truth. And we really know that’s exactly where any loyalty program, you know, lives and breathes and succeeds or fails.
So it doesn’t matter how much work, how much money, how much technology we have in place behind the scenes. It doesn’t matter if they don’t believe in it, first and foremost, and have the tools available. So I wanted to ask you actually, Joanna, as well, because I know you are head of product. What was the the insight behind, you know, bringing the staff into the same digital ecosystem, I guess, that your consumers are doing? Because I know you had a solution already, I think with swipe cards.
Joanna: Correct. Plastic cards.
Paula: Yes. Staff discounts. So tell us about that. Was it was a difficult decision internally, because I suppose the simplicity also with having a card and taking, you know, I suppose some of the resources to dedicate to staff, I guess is also something means you’ve had to select on your roadmap that this is going to be a priority.
Joanna: Exactly. As you can imagine, you know, in every company similar to us, what I just mentioned before, our backlog is huge, but of course, you know, with around 70,000 employees in Alshaya, you know, we have a huge number of customers who are already Aura members, so they already enjoy, you know, that digital side of the loyalty program.
But they still, even for myself, you know, when I go to get my Starbucks coffee or to shop Boots, you know, you just first, you scan your Aura to get your points. You have to then, swipe your, you know, blue card as we call it our advantage card and then eventually you pay, right? So you have, you know, three steps in a row, which isn’t any seamless journey and isn’t great, right?
So since last year we had to know lots of people asking, can we do something? Can we do something? Can we digitalize? And and then yes, the, decision has been made, executive decision has been made. You know, guys, let’s do it. We try still last year, but then we were running out of the budget. So it’s like, okay, let’s try to squeeze it somehow this year.
So our managers, you know, collaborated together. They made decision. Let’s make it happen.
Paula: Yeah.
Joanna: And there was a bit of a challenge to our tech teams, you know, where they had to do it with minimum investment and minimum change. So we can really turn it around quickly.
Paula: Yeah.
Joanna: And and yes, so basically what that means is basically, our employees just have to, in the back end, they have to just connect Aura with their employee number. That’s it. So the moment they come into the store, they scan Aura app, they are recognized as a loyalty member so they can earn reading points, and at the same time, they are recognized as employees so the discount is applied automatically. So there is no more walk in there for them. So that journey become really much more interesting and much more seamless.
So and we are launching in a week of time, actually on the 24th of September. So yeah, it’s another great achievement in terms of, you know, digitalizing all what we do in Alshaya.
Paula: Incredible. Yeah. So that’s not yet launched at this moment?
Joanna: So it is in stores, unofficially, but the official launch is on the 24th. Oh my goodness. Yes, so whoever knows, like, I was testing at Starbucks in, you know, in our office. Okay. Starbucks, so it works.
Paula: Yeah. Yeah. Well done. Honestly, no, but you’re absolutely right. Like we talked about simplicity and there are so many steps in every journey. And who, none of us wants to be swiping three cards and checking, have you got my staff number? Am I getting my discounts? And my points? So there’s actually an awful lot going on again at that moment of truth. So incredible. So I’m really impressed.
Joanna: Who carries a wallet with them? You know, like, I don’t carry my wallet with me anymore. Right? I want to have everything.
Paula: It’s phone only. Absolutely. We have to be digital first. And I guess you’re saving a lot of cost as well then because the plastic cards.
Joanna: That’s it. Exactly right. As mentioned, right? It’s 70, 000 employees and imagine once per year, ideally, you would have to change it, you know, when you swipe it so many times when you get your coffee from Starbucks obviously, you know, it just doesn’t last. Right. So you have that extra cost. So yes, it’s also helping.
Paula: Amazing.
Joanna: And that entire, you know, it helps our environment, you know, of course, with Alshaya, we also want to, you know, go towards sustainability, obviously. Right. So we want to become more green, less plastic, you know, more environment friendly. So that’s also one of the things.
Paula: Of course. Of course. Yeah. Nida, you referenced Kuwait, of course, as the home market where Alshaya was founded. And I saw the latest news in terms of the proposition for what Aura has launched in Kuwait.
Nida: I know.
Paula: So please tell our audience, because this, I think is a world first, if I’m not mistaken.
Nida: It, yeah, it possibly is. Aura is now mobile. Like, you know, yes. So that’s when I say that to many people, they’re like, what? But like loyalty program becomes mobile.
Paula: I know. Yeah.
Nida: I was like, yes, it’s connectivity.
Paula: Yeah. And for clarity, it’s a telecommunications.
Nida: It is.
Paula: Not just a mobile app, because that’s obviously what mobile can mean. So literally.
Nida: It is telecom.
Paula: Yeah. So you’ve become a telecoms company. I’m guessing if I can remember my terminology, I worked in telecoms a long time ago, but a mobile virtual network, if that’s.
Nida: Not yet. That’s the ambition in the future. Once we see how we go. So right now it’s a partnership. Okay. It’s a partnership with Ooreedoo who are the best telecom provider in Kuwait. Alshaya, which is the best retail and best loyalty program coming together.
Paula: Yes.
Nida: As you can imagine, Aura, you know, being Alshaya’s hometown being Kuwait, Aura has a great presence there. It’s really loved by customers. So it’s about expanding that offering to more aspects of our customers lives. Like, you know, the way we’re looking at how we scale this program now is how can we touch more aspects of our customers life, especially in the core areas that Alshaya doesn’t operate within.
So the partnership with Telecom is, you know, a natural blend, because we know our customers are always on the go, they’re always researching things before they enter our stores or before they shop our website. So why not bring in that element of connectivity as well into their lives and just create a proposition that ties it back to Alshaya.
So everything that we’re doing now in the second phase of Aura is about bringing it back to Alshaya because it’s about all these experiences that, you know, connects the customer, rewards the customer, but then it serves the brands, it brings it back to the brands, and it creates more stickiness with the Alshaya brands.
Paula: Yeah. Beautifully said, Nida. And and as you said, absolutely telecommunications is something that I think actually we all take for granted.
Nida: Yes.
Paula: And it is one of those utilities, as you know, I started in loyalty in telecom, But we didn’t have a points currency. So if I’m understanding correctly, there’ll be Aura Points for customers in Kuwait on the Ooreedoo network within this partnership.
Nida: Yeah. So basically it’s a brand new brand called Aura Mobile which is in partnership with Ooreedoo. The, you know, the technology, the back end, everything powered by Ooreedoo.
Paula: Yeah.
Nida: The brand is Aura Mobile. So what it unlocks for you is more than just your telecom benefits. Yes. You’ve got your ultra fast 5G, you’ve got your roaming data minutes, so on and so forth.
But with Aura Mobile, it, you know, it caters to the customers in Kuwait who on the go. They love shopping. They love dining. So you get exclusive perks and exclusive discounts within Alshaya Brands. You also get to collect points on your mobile spend. In the future, we’ll look at, you know, whether they can redeem their points as well on their mobile spend.
But right now, you can collect points on your spend. And if you know, take on certain services within the mobile plan, you get upgraded to, you know, our start here as well. And you know, you unlock more privileges. So more to come. This was the first phase of the launch. You know, we’ve got really exciting plans in terms of how we hype up more engagement on a certain day of the week, or how do we create more rewards and there’s more we need to understand as well from a consumer sentiment.
Paula: Yeah.
Nida: But we definitely know that this as a proposition is playing. There’s a gap in the market where consumers are just paying for a mobile plan, you know, it’s a utility as you mentioned, but how do you add more of a lifestyle element to it that, you know, that they do anyway, but how can we sort of reward them for that and create, you know more for them.
Yeah. And I’m, and I know this is a global podcast, but being here in the UAE, everybody knows how much they pay for for any telecommunication service. So this is great value in Kuwait, I can assure you that.
Paula: Indeed. Yeah. And I don’t know the statistics. I haven’t looked at them in a long time, Nida, but certainly I remember that mobile penetration was in excess of a hundred percent in this part of the world. A lot of people do carry two mobile phones.
Nida: Absolutely.
Paula: And, you know, we probably have a higher.
Nida: It’s very true for Kuwait. Yeah. Everybody’s got, you know, two lines minimum. And yeah, it’s a huge penetration.
Paula: Exactly. So it’s something they really value. And as you said, as Alshaya, of course, you want to be connected when they’re not necessarily in the stores or in the restaurants or whatever. So it’s an amazing opportunity to tie it into a full ecosystem. So back to the coalition idea, I guess as well. So more opportunities to earn.
The other piece that I know is a big upcoming announcement for you guys is in the cobrand space.
Nida: Yes.
Paula: So maybe Nida, you might refer to that. I know it’s not yet in market, but tell us about the thinking. And again, just as context, we were just down in South Africa talking with a lot of retail brands there. And there seemed to be a lot of brands in that country that don’t have co brands. Here there are quite a lot. We’ve already talked about Marriott Bonvoy, for example, but it’s amazing that you guys are getting into this space. I always wished I’d had the opportunity to launch a co brand of envy going on here in terms of your professional career. So talk us through the co brand idea.
Nida: Yeah, I mean, loyalty and payments, honestly, they’ve, you know, really sort of merged in the last few years together. Whether it’s just the, you know, the fact that the co brand kind of accelerates your ability to unlock those rewards.
But also from a simplicity point of view, because when you link payments and when you link loyalty together, you make that experience, you know, become faster, more effortless, and more engaging for the customer. So we’ve got loads coming up in the space of payments and loyalty.
One such announcement is the co-brand. So we’ve tied up with MasterCard exclusively to launch the Aura co-brand in the markets that Aura operates in. Soon to come again in our hometown in Kuwait. We, you know, wanna launch first in Kuwait and we really see what the co-brand as well another aspect of life embedded in it, where, you know, where you go, there’s going to be rewards through Aura.
Paula: Yeah.
Nida: So, yeah, I mean, it’s very exciting to think of this next phase of Aura because yes, you’ve got the likes of the Marriott and the Skywards and stuff that, you know, they are known to be the best co brands out there. And then there’s yet to be someone who’s cracked it for retail. And we’re really hoping that We get the stride with retail and yeah, quite exciting.
Paula: Indeed. Indeed. And Joanna, from your perspective as you said, so much time, so much energy and focus in terms of, again, getting the foundations in place to facilitate the likes of wallets and all of these kinds of things.
So, so what are you most excited about given that, you know, you’ve got like this huge, you know, milestone, all of these things already launched. I’m sure you still have lots of ideas in terms of what’s coming. What are you thinking about?
Joanna: Yes, definitely. And one of them is you just mentioned, Paula, it’s our wallet as well, right? So now actually we launched it this week in the UAE. Okay, so it’s available in other stores and also embedded in our app. Yeah. So basically the feature on its own in the first phase allows you to put your refunds directly into the wallet. You know, so when you return the product, you can install, then you can basically, you know, instead of waiting 14 days until the money is back on your credit card, it basically goes directly into your wallet.
Paula: Okay.
Joanna: So it’s real time. And, you know, obviously from the customer perspective, very easy, very seamless. You don’t have to think about anything. Again, it’s just a single scan of the Aura app. So, so which you would be scanning and you don’t have to do anything else and you don’t have to wait.
And of course, from the business perspective, it’s very important for us, right? You know, it’s very important to keep, you know, this funds within our ecosystem, right? So there is a higher chance, you know, for this money being spent within our brands, right? So that’s kind of, you know, that’s the first phase we have launched within. And then now the teams are working on having an option where you can, you know, simply top it up with your credit card.
You can save your credit card. So then basically you literally don’t need your credit card, don’t need anything. You know, you just go and exactly one tap and redeem pay. That’s it. Right.
Paula: Amazing.
Joanna: So that’s exactly what’s, you know, what’s coming within this year as well.
Paula: Oh my goodness.
Joanna: So a lot of, I mean, I don’t know how we did that.
Nida: Every announcement you’ve made is last week, this week, next month, next round.
Joanna: But literally, I don’t know how we did that.
Paula: I honestly, we timed this recording perfectly. So, I mean, I know we actually, we had hoped to do it maybe a few months ago, but you guys are so swamped and now I understand.
Joanna: Yeah. And we are not five hundred people team, really not.
Paula: We talked about that. Do tell us how many’s in your team. I know you’re leading the team. So how many have you got?
Nida: We’ve got 17 people in this region. It’s not a Qantas. Oh, what’s the number again?
Paula: 600. Yeah. Yes.
Nida: No.
Paula: Yeah. Honestly. Yeah. And again, just for the audience who weren’t here, actually, it was loyalty connect in Dubai, where I was delighted to have one of the loyalty directors from Qantas. And I just kind of, you know, I just kept going, wow, it feels like there’s so much happening. Like, how can you manage that? Like what kind of resources? And she said, my team is 650 people and I nearly fell off the stage. So, so I totally get it.
And 17 people delivering all of those propositions. And actually, I remember you used the term, Joanna, like super app.
Joanna: Correct.
Paula: And it almost feels like that’s your vision.
Joanna: That’s it. That’s exactly it. Yeah. So that was the purpose of why do we want to bring it in house, right? So we can really grow it into the super app. So as we say, you know, is it for the customers? Is it for our colleagues? We just bring it all together. So, you know, we are working on many things.
You can imagine there are also digital receipts being more and more popular as well, right? You know, so instead of sending in WhatsApp and spending millions of dirhams, you know, the cost, bring, we are bringing it to Aura app, right? You know, to bring another saving for the company and for the customer. It’s just everything in one place, right?
Paula: Wonderful.So they’re currently delivered on WhatsApp, is that the case? Which is expensive.
Joanna: Very expensive. It costs millions of dirhams, as you can imagine, per year, right?
Paula: See, I didn’t have that insight. I mean, I know there’s costs, of course, for commercial use of WhatsApp.
It’s something actually, again, I know I’m talking about South Africa a lot, but we’re just back from there. But I love to hear about innovation. And to me, like we talked about WhatsApp with a mutual friend of ours about three years ago and what could its role be in loyalty? Clearly it has an amazing opportunity.
Again, I think the actual engagement in WhatsApp with this part of the world is off the charts.
Joanna: Absolutely. Absolutely. I think nowhere else.
Paula: Yeah. But it comes at a cost.
Joanna: That’s it. Yeah. That’s it.
Paula: So essentially now you’ll be able to provide those digital receipts within the app, which means people can access them any time. And I guess to your earlier point about sustainability, actually, I really feel that for me, I really don’t like now when somebody hands me a paper receipt. It really feels like unnecessary.
Joanna: Indeed.
Paula: And again, it’s not something I’m going to keep or be able to find. So having it in the application is amazing.
Yeah. So, okay. So we’ve got a super app and I almost, I’m like, you know, what are you going to do next year? I feel like it’s kind of like it’s done.
Joanna: It’s a huge roadmap and that meeting actually we are planning to have in an hour from now.
Paula: Okay.
Joanna: We just want to talk about that.
Paula: You’re starting planning.
Nida: I think, I mean, you know, just building on it. The vision is We’re quite fortunate to work somewhere where there’s an investment, there’s the backing of it, there’s, you know, the SLT behind it, but also our bosses, like, you know, having a very strong and clear vision. And I think the two key themes that keep emerging as customer and colleagues, and just making their lives better and simpler.
So everything that we’re doing now from the start of this year was to own that experience, to bring it back in house. And I don’t think any of the scalability would have been possible if we didn’t own that experience. And now we’re just building on it. Everything is an iteration to what’s there. Digital receipts, you know, gamification is next, personalization is a hot topic that we keep talking about.
Paula: Yes.
Nida: So much more to come.
Paula: Indeed. Yeah.
Joanna: It’s very busy. I was trying to put it over the air. I was like, wow, what are we going to do?
Paula: Everyone’s impatient. Again it’s, I think specifically in this region as well, like, you know, we’re all very impatient because we want the best in the world. And as long as you do have senior leadership behind it, I think that is absolutely at the risk of, you know, being too positive, there’s always challenges along the way. And again, a few sleepless nights, perhaps for all of us, you know, when we go through big projects like this.
So maybe Joanna, first, I’ll just ask you, if you think about the kind of challenges either you know, coming to this point or coming ahead, what to you are the biggest challenges as a loyalty marketer that you think we face? Because I think again, the whole industry has the same issues and we probably don’t talk about them enough.
Joanna: Definitely. And when I think again, from, you know, perspective on my position as a head of product at the moment, and with exactly what I describe in terms of how many projects and products actually we have delivered this year.
Paula: Yeah.
Joanna: You know, you are constantly in that project phase, you know, you don’t really take time to step back, think back, think about the BAU, you know, you’re just launching new one, new one, new one.
Paula: Yeah.
Joanna: We keep on talking, we have to do the wash up, we have lessons learned, we have to apply them, but then we keep on talking about this and there is just new thing coming in, you know, this is one of the I think more of the biggest challenges, you know, from my perspective at this point of time with, you know, having that huge roadmap and, you know, so many things to be delivered.
Paula: Yeah. Yeah. It’s a fair point. Absolutely. And actually sometimes this, you know, show and this podcast is an opportunity to reflect on what you have achieved. So hopefully you did.
Joanna: That’s very true. Yes.
Paula: Think about, because as we said, you know, all we’ve talked about today is all of these propositions that are all brand new. You’ve rolled out literally, I think four in the last eight weeks. So you know, I’m exhausted just kind of sitting, hearing about all of this amazing stuff. Nida, final one then to you in terms of like challenges.
Nida: Challenges, right?
Paula: What would you say that you think is?
Nida: I think we’re still in that sort of early maturity phase of the program, right? And there’s so much that’s gone in, like if you think two and a half years, like, and I think back of my experience in Europe and stuff like that, this would take like, you know, five to 10 years to get here.
Paula: Yeah.
Nida: So, we’ve, for our own sake, I think we’ve grown too fast too quickly and we’ve got loads of members, loads of data. New propositions to handle. I think for me personally as running this program, it’s about how do you now sort of, you know, really seek value from everything that you’ve built.
Paula: Yeah.
Nida: You know, making sure that these products are successful.
Paula: Yeah.
Nida: They appeal to the customer. Are they really what the customer wants? So it’s, you know, doing that check-in.
Paula: Yeah.
Nida: Quite frequently, but also the data, like the, you know, it’s huge, right? And when you start looking at the industry we’re in, like, it’s, it’s so vast, like you’ve got pharmaceuticals, you’ve got someone who’s, you know, furnishing their home, someone who’s just a new mom, like, and someone who’s just casually shopping or dining, right?
So you’ve got all these different personas and you’ve got to make the program relevant to them, speak to them, create the right office for them, the communications for them. So I think personalization is still a hot topic that we we, you know, we’re coming up with, but there’s just. so much in the world of personalization, like.
Paula: Yeah.
Nida: What’s personal to you may not feel like it’s personal to you, you know, like and yeah, and just cracking that is so complex. Yes. But it’s it’s a fun challenge. I’m yet to find someone who’s nailed personalization like perfectly.
Like I was watching Netflix last night and I was flicking through and even then it’s like, we recommend this for you. I’m like, no, like it doesn’t work for me. And it’s, that’s like after sifting through like, you know, flicking through 50 pieces of content, none of which that spoke to me. And I was like, wow, like imagine the kind of offers and content you have to fuel into the system for one of it to resonate or not. Yeah. So yeah, I think that’s a, that’s the big challenge here.
Paula: Well, and I was absolutely going to reassure you as well, Nida, because honestly, everyone I speak to when I say, you know, how do you feel about personalization either as a consumer in terms of what you experience or as a brand leader who again has the senior leadership team, has the budget, has the technology. It still feels like we’re very early in that personalization journey. So you’re definitely not alone.
And I think we’ll all benefit as we start to see, I suppose, whether it’s or whatever these capabilities are, they’ll all start to deliver optimized programs. So you have two and a half years of data, so I can only imagine the amount of insights that are available, but of course it takes time to pull those out as well. And of course action them into what’s needed.
So listen, that is actually all of the questions. I know you’re going straight off to a planning meeting now.
Nida: Talking about the next thing we’re going to launch.
Paula: Yeah. Pause. And please do acknowledge to all of them from our side, at least that we think you’re doing an amazing job. Clearly the International Loyalty Awards. I think you’re doing an amazing job. We had some time together with our friends at Comarch as well earlier in the year. So I wanted to give a shout out to them. And so that’s all from my side. Is there anything else maybe either of you wanted to mention before we wrap up?
I definitely want to make sure to put your LinkedIn because we don’t have enough retail loyalty expertise on this show. So if that’s okay, I’d love to link to both of you in the show notes.
Nida: Absolutely.
Paula: But any closing thoughts that you want to share with our global audience?
Nida: Shout out wise, I think both Joe and I are representing you know, that 17 super people who work behind the scenes. So a big shout out to them. You know, they really are sort of superhumans who make all this possible. So that’s great. And yeah, I think it’s, I mean, Aura is honestly like such an exciting program, such an exciting chapter of both our careers. So, yes lots more to come there.
Paula: Indeed. So that means you’ll have to come back on the show. Yes. Again. Any closing thoughts from you, Joanna?
Joanna: I think, thank you for joining me here or for making me join you, whichever way around, but it’s been really a pleasure and it is pleasure, you know, having great leaders, obviously.
Paula: Absolutely.
Joanna: You know, who know how to manage huge loyalty program for 70 brands and eight and a half million members. So Nida, well done.
Nida: Thank you.
Paula: Yeah. Well said. As I said, I have total professional envy going on. So Nida Unas and Joanna Witsch, from Alshaya Group and the Aura Program. Thank you so much. Let’s Talk Loyalty and Loyalty TV.
Joanna: Thank you very much, Paula.
Nida: Thank you.
Joanna: Thank you.
Paula: This show is sponsored by Wise Marketer Group, publisher of the Wise Marketer, the premier digital customer loyalty marketing resource for industry relevant news, insights and research. Wise Marketer Group also offers loyalty education and training globally through it’s Loyalty Academy, which has certified nearly 900 marketers and executives in 49 countries as certified loyalty marketing professionals.
For global coverage of customer engagement and loyalty, check out thewise marketer.com and become a wiser marketer or subscriber. Learn more about global loyalty education for individuals or corporate training programs at loyaltyacademy.org.
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