Paula: Welcome to Let’s Talk Loyalty, an industry podcast for loyalty marketing professionals. I’m Paula Thomas, the Founder and CEO of Let’s Talk Loyalty and also now Loyalty TV. Today’s episode is hosted by Charlie Hills, Chief Strategy Officer of Mando-Connect, a UK based agency that uses smart data to create brilliant partnerships and rewards that really work.
If you work in loyalty marketing, you can watch our latest video interviews every Thursday on www. loyalty.tv. And of course, you can also listen to Let’s Talk Loyalty every Tuesday, every Wednesday, and every Thursday to learn the latest ideas from loyalty experts around the world.
Charlie: Hello and welcome to Let’s Talk Loyalty. I’m Charlie Hills, the Chief Strategy Officer for Mando-Connect, WPP is Loyalty Specialist Partnerships and Rewards Agency. We have created a white paper in partnership with YouGov that explores loyalty membership appeal and impact across 24 European markets, and I’m delighted to be hosting a series of podcasts featuring European loyalty experts to help listeners better understand loyalty across the region.
Today, I’m delighted to welcome Kirsty Chalk, the Marketing and Member Acquisition Leader for Rewards for IKEA Family. IKEA is a global home furnishing brand, bringing affordability, design and comfort to people all over the world with the vision of creating a better everyday life for many people. Their loyalty program, IKEA Family, was first launched in Sweden in 1984 and now has over 190 million members worldwide.
Kirsty is responsible for creating and executing the external launch campaign for 30 markets to announce, engage, and educate existing and potential IKEA Family members with the newest program benefit rewards from IKEA Family. Today we’ll be learning about Kirsty’s favorite loyalty programs, how IKEA Family is engaging its millions of members across the globe, and all about their plans for the future.
I hope you enjoy our conversation today.
Charlie: So, hello, Kirsty. Welcome to Let’s Talk Loyalty. We’re delighted to have you on here as a guest today. Thanks for joining us.
Kirsty: Hi, Charlie. Thanks for having me. It’s really nice to be here.
Charlie: I can’t wait to hear more about your program. It’s one, obviously, that nobody listening to the podcast will have ever heard of, a really unknown brand. But before we get into your brilliant program, it’d be really interesting to start with Paula’s favorite question. So, we ask all our guests this question. Please, Kirsty, tell us, what is your favorite loyalty program? And, of course, why is it your favorite loyalty program?
Kirsty: So I’m going to be cheeky and actually have two, if that is okay.
Charlie: That’s fine.
Kirsty: Well, so I have one from a customer point of view, and then one from a loyalty professional point of view, because as a customer, I definitely sit on the kind of very simple and clear end of the scale. So for me, it’s as obvious and basic as it can possibly be, which leads nicely to a benefit for me as a person.
so that one currently is Waterstones, which is a bookseller here in the UK. So it is a kind of really traditional, really simple program of you collect 10 stamps, which I think is about 100 pounds spend, and then you get 10 pounds back to spend in store. And for me, I’ve definitely noticed that this has led to me buying all of my books now from Waterstone and, my to be read pile is definitely growing. So yeah, for me, it’s just as simple as possible. It’s really nicely integrated with their apps. I can see it on there. I can track it on there along with my wish list and I definitely fall into that wshat can I get as a benefit as quickly as possible?
Charlie: Oh, that is a lovely story. I absolutely adore that program. I’m a total bookworm and I’ve got a lovely Waterstones just around the corner from me, as well as a Cafe Nero and it is one of my favorite things to do. Just wander along, get a nice book and then go for a coffee and actually get a bit of peace and downtime. And it is, it’s a lovely program and I love what they’ve done with integration in their stores and their architecture and all their staff really know how it works and they always remind you of it. And yeah, that’s brilliant program, this excellent choice from a customer point of view.
And then from a loyalty professional point of view, what’s the other one?
Kirsty: Uh, so for me, it’s the brands that are starting to look at integrating communities within their loyalty program. So we’re seeing a lot with sports brands, so Nike, Adidas, that kind of thing. There’s also a local brand to me that is a sportswear brand called VX3. So they mainly used to supply kind of school, sports kits and local club sports kits but they’ve actually started a run club. They’ve kind of copied what Nike and Adidas have done in some of the bigger cities.
We have a run club and it’s really nice to see that community building around it and the relationships between your customers kind of growing. So we regularly meet every Sunday morning, and we’ve got loyalty stamps for how many runs you’ve been to.
Charlie: Oh, wow.
Kirsty: And you can then get merchandise. So I have socks and t-shirts with all the run club branding and then of course we’re used in all of their social media marketing now. So there’s lots of videos of us all running by the sea, so yeah.
Charlie: That’s brilliant. That’s a lovely example. Yeah. I think that’s one of the under kind of underrated areas of loyalty programs actually, because when they, you know, 10 years ago, community was such a huge element. Everyone was really trying and there were lots of forums as part of loyalty programs and sort of discussions and chat rooms and things. And then actually that sort of dropped off in this real focus just on cost of living crisis and value, value, value. And it’s really lovely to see it coming back. I think that’s a great example.
The sports sector is fascinating at the moment. I think the things that they’re trying out and, and what the other sectors can learn from. We, we showcase the cannon club in our white paper, the understanding loyalty in Europe, my paper for that exact reason. Actually, what a brilliant community of photographers having these just these incredible shots, you know, even from amateur and kind of, you know, just casual photographers as well as the pros. So that’s a really nice kind of trend to see.
Kirsty: I think we’re also as a society kind of losing communities in general. So kind of some of the historical ones that you had around religions around the local pub, around kind of sports clubs, some of those have kind of fallen by the wayside. So actually, now it’s where do you find those? And where do you find those like minded people? And actually brands, we can sometimes bring them together. so I think it’s yeah, a lovely thing that we actually need to kind of get more offline as well.
Charlie: That’s very nice.
Kirsty: But then yeah, kind of works both ways and then can really benefit both sides.
Charlie: Yeah, I think that’s lovely. And also presumably on a personal level, that’s great because it must make you actually go for the run as well, like because you can’t possibly miss out on your stamp for your club.
Kirsty: Exactly. And I also, so, pushing me to run a little bit further. Sometimes I can be very guilty on my own of doing kind of like, yeah, I’ll just stop there. I’ve done 4k, whereas actually if you’re running with a group of people, and then we all get coffee afterwards. So it’s very nice and very sociable.
Charlie: That’s really lovely. That’s a great story. I’m going to look that program up. It’s not a brand I’d heard of before today, so I’ll make sure I check it out.
Well, as well as us now knowing that you’re a runner, obviously, tell us a little bit more about your background and, and, you know, in particular, your loyalty background and what you enjoy about working in loyalty marketing. How did you end up in this brilliant role?
Kirsty: So I studied marketing years ago at university, and then spent a little bit of time kind of trying to figure out how to actually get into it. I think a lot of us do that and ended up in sales for a little while before finding IKEA. I now work. So, I actually started as an IKEA Family specialist in a store in the UK seven, nearly eight years ago now.
Charlie: Wow.
Kirsty: So that was my very first kind of loyalty role and I’ve not left since. I’ve just kind of, kind of grown and developed with that. So, yeah, I had a role in store and that was around opening a new store, lots of events and workshops for our members, and then also training coworkers on the benefits of the program and the reason why we need to ask for it every time.
And then from there, I did a trial project which was a combination between Global and we used the UK market as a trial for a community platform actually.
Charlie: Oh really?
Kirsty: Yes.
Charlie: I haven’t read.
Kirsty: Yes. So it was Kind of, I guess, between a Pinterest and an Instagram where we were connecting members to help each other out with any home furnishing problems, challenges they face. Sometimes people just want that extra opinion of, I have this kind of awkward space, what do I do with it? How can I make this work? I need to do this. That this, this and this in it, how can I do that? And actually we saw a lot of lovely people responding and kind of sharing things they’ve done at home, but then also sharing specific IKEA products that they thought might help with what they were doing.
And then right now I am the marketing leader for rewards from IKEA Family. So this is a new benefit we’re rolling out to our members. So I’ve been doing that for three years now. And so far we’ve launched three markets. We have a lot more markets and kind of the planning phase and getting ready to launch.
Charlie: Oh, how exciting to like actually have come up through the store and then work through those projects and now get to roll it out on a sort of pan European or is it even a global level?
Kirsty: Global, I say.
Charlie: Fantastic. How cool. Well, I mean, I’m sure everyone is familiar with the IKEA Family program. I’m sure that most of us actually have the membership, me included. But one of the things I find so interesting is how it varies by market by market. The, you know, the initiatives that you’re piloting and then rolling out is fascinating.
So for the benefit of our listeners, could you please explain a little bit more about the program, what it is and how it works and, and what people get?
Kirsty: Yep. So we have IKEA Family now in 30 markets. And we have over 190 million members right now, which is crazy to think about. And then we have what we would call Baseline Benefits, and this is what most of the markets would offer. So we have member pricing and member office throughout the store. We have free hot drink, which I know a lot of people love and are big fans of.
Charlie: Yeah.
Kirsty: Then we have events and workshops, which the markets run kind of at a local level, and they decide how many of them they do and what type they are. Then we also have something called Just In Case Protection, which is It’s incredible. I feel like not enough people know about this one, but it basically means that if you, buy an IKEA product, when you’re taking it home or building it, you damage it or break it, we will replace it for you.
Charlie: Oh, wow. I didn’t know about that one.
Kirsty: It’s kind of like peace of mind insurance. It works slightly different in each of the markets, but it’s a good kind of product insurance to cover you there as well.
And then the benefit that I specifically work on at the moment is for rewards. So this is allowing members to collect points for both transactions and interactions and then choose a reward that works for them.
Charlie: Oh, nice. And what markets is that live in at the moment?
Kirsty: So it’s live in Portugal, Italy and Australia right now. UK, Ireland and Germany are coming soon. I can’t give you a launch date.
Charlie: Excellent.
Kirsty: I’m afraid.
Charlie: I live in Great Britain, so I’m thrilled about that one. I’ll be keeping a lookout for it.
Kirsty: Yes, you guys should see it very soon. Hopefully, we’re just kind of finalizing things with the UK market. So, yeah.
Charlie: Oh, how fabulous. That’s, I mean, it’s something I think everyone’s wanted from the program for so long, that opportunity to earn and burn. So, I’m really excited to see it come to life. I mean, it seems daft to ask this as a question when you’ve just told us out what the benefits are, but what do you think is the sort of the main thing that sets IKEA Family apart from the other programs? You know, what should other programs be looking to your program and learning from?
Kirsty: I think we’re seeing a lot of people grow in having both emotional and transactional benefits. And I think that’s where we were kind of maybe falling down before we didn’t have a points offering. But it’s kind of how do you have both and how do you have the combination and then communicate that in a really clear and simple way.
Because I think the more benefits we add, sometimes the more confusing that can get for customers. And actually it’s how do we talk about that in a really simple way and make them understand exactly what they get and exactly what’s in it for them.
Charlie: That’s brilliant. And presumably having, you know, as a brand built many, many, many instruction manuals over time with diagrams and visuals that the whole world knows. Presumably you’re going to be one of the best at communicating how a loyalty program works and what people actually need to do. I’m really hoping there’s a component of building to what we actually need to kind of create.
What about trends that you’re seeing? I know, you know, IKEA is famous as a brand right at the forefront of sustainability, really interesting things in the retail space, you know, such an innovative brand, but particularly in the loyalty industry. What sort of trends are you seeing? What are you noticing at the moment that you’re thinking about?
Kirsty: So we’re seeing a couple of different things. community, which we’ve already touched on is definitely a big thing, but then we’re also seeing with this younger generation, a trend towards more emotional loyalty and away from those traditional transactional benefits.
But then because we have this broad spectrum of customers that kind of fall into different generations. Actually, it’s how do we reach all of them and what benefits are most applicable for which generation? So yeah, I think we’re going to start to see a lot more kind of experience events a lot more kind of early access maybe to sales, member exclusive products. We’re starting to see with quite a few of the big brands and I think those are really interesting areas to watch develop and see how that grows.
But then also tying into that AI and the developments we’re seeing with that in terms of how can we use that to help us personalize our offering. So I think we’re going to start to see that a lot more. I think a lot of brands are doing a couple of tests, trials, and kind of feeling their way out at the moment and starting to figure out, okay, how can we use this both for us and also for the customers?
Charlie: Yeah, I think that’s a really nice kind of roundup of actually some of the key things that are the hot talking points at the moment. I mean, I don’t think I’ve been at a conference where AI hasn’t been at least sort of a quarter of the agenda and everyone’s slightly afraid, aren’t they? It’s like, oh gosh, what can we do and what are the capabilities and how do we use it? But a common thread does seem to be personalization at scale.
And interesting that you highlight that demographic kind of shift that we’re seeing, but presumably you also have, you know, people shopping for work, people shopping for pleasure, for different rooms at different life stages, because IKEA really is a brand for everyone, isn’t it? How do you think about that in the loyalty space? How do you tailor to all those different sorts of audiences at the moment?
Kirsty: So we actually have two different loyalty programs, so I work on IKEA Family, which is for consumers, but then we also have IKEA Business Network, which is for small businesses. So we did a lot of research and that kind of looks a little bit at hospitality industry, like smaller Airbnb type industry, maybe smaller offices. So it’s really for that kind of small business and supporting them. But yeah, there’s a whole different lot of benefits for, for business network members.
Charlie: Yeah, I think that’s really smart. Actually, that’s probably one of the trends that we’re seeing as well. We were talking about it earlier that, that recognition that actually one loyalty program doesn’t work for every different segment. So it’s great. There’s a business you’ve recognized, you know, this small businesses have a totally different need.
What about partners? You know, IKEA is notorious, let’s say, as a brand, in the partnership space. But, you know, is there a role for brand partners in your program? And, or even at the sort of master brand level, what do you see as the sort of highlight partnerships?
Kirsty: So we’re quite limited on what we do in terms of partnerships.
Charlie: Exactly.
Kirsty: Actually, at the moment, Some of our markets offer it. and we actually see it more as a market local specific ledger benefit. Italy is a very good example. They’ve got a really well established partnership program and it links you out to a whole different platform. And there’s a whole host of kind of partnership benefits you can pick from that.
But I think there’s a challenge around. Do we have something that we see as being a global fit? And I think we’re potentially starting some of those conversations around kind of Is there a role for that in the future? And what would that look like at a global level? And also what would we recommend to the markets in terms of ways of working with that and kind of guidelines and frameworks? Because I think we’ve maybe ignored it a little bit at a global level, but I definitely think there’s a role for it moving forward.
Charlie: I mean, I think I’ve worked in partnerships for over 20 years, and I think IKEA is on nearly every brand’s hit list as a desirable partner, and, you know, it’s always such a challenge in terms of actually we think about it, but, you know, actually we won’t implement it. So, it’s interesting to hear that some of the markets are actually, I suppose, piloting and trialing in models. I’ll check out the Italian program.
What about the importance of the loyalty program in the IKEA ecosystem? There’s so many initiatives, you know, there’s so much exciting things happening in the brand. Where does the loyalty program sit? How important is it to, you know, at the board level?
Kirsty: I think this has definitely grown over the last few years certainly since I’ve been with the global team, I’ve seen the kind of profile of it raise a lot. But I also know from a loyalty team point of view, we’ve gotten better at having conversations around the value that we bring and the commercial side of it.
Because of course, we can be really guilty of this in marketing where we talk about all of the nice engagement metrics, but then it’s like, okay, what does that actually mean from a monetary point of view? And sometimes when you’re having those high level board conversations, that’s what they care about is the bottom line. They obviously do care about the nice metrics as well, but you need to be able to have conversations that tap into both. So I think it’s definitely becoming kind of higher profile. We’re getting better at having those conversations and then talking about the value that we bring, but then the value we can bring in future as well, and then also our ways of working have improved in terms of getting involved in, in projects or kind of bigger program, like bigger marketing programs earlier on in the process.
In the past, we can have been guilty of being kind of an added on at the end part of the program or part of the marketing plans and things. It’s sort of added at the end.
Charlie: Yeah, I’m hearing that a lot, actually, from a lot of our guests. Last month, I was interviewing Eurostar, an almost identical kind of discussion around the importance of having big internal kickoffs and building the internal profile of the program.
And almost actually that being almost as important as the external profile of the program for actually being part of that big marketing calendar, and in particular, the IT stack, work stack and actually getting kind of developments through the business. So again, I think that’s probably a common internal theme.
But given your history as well, you must also be thinking about the importance of it at a store level. You know, if actually that’s where you started, you know, how does IKEA manage that? How do they engage their store staff in actually what the program is, how do you operate those kind of things and get them to love it?
Kirsty: Yeah. So we have a customer engagement and loyalty team in each of the markets. So each market has kind of a, we call it a service office, so like a head office for each market. And then we also have a lot of the markets would have a loyalty specialist per store. So they sit within the marketing team and are responsible for kind of coworker training, particularly, we’re using them a lot when it comes to rewards.
So actually, we have, a store ambassador when we’re going through the launch process. So they need to kind of coordinate the testing of anything that we want, the internal communications for the new benefit, deliver all the co-worker training on the new rewards benefit, but also make sure that kind of senior management in a store is clear on kind of what’s coming and why we’re doing this. So they’re really key for that education piece.
And I think that ongoing relationship with the markets where, you know, we have monthly calls with the markets where they would present best case examples of things they’ve done. We would talk about things that are upcoming from a global point of view, what we’re working on. So it’s that kind of sharing back and forth. And I think that’s That’s really important and really helps us understand what’s going on with them as well.
Charlie: That sounds like a really collaborative approach actually, right from sort of the most senior to the most frontline and then across all the markets. I love that idea of that monthly call where everyone’s sort of sharing best practice. Do you ever have markets go, Oh, we’re going to go and do that, or we’re going to kind of lift that from one market to another, or is it more of the global team? You’re going actually, what can we learn sort of centrally and then push back out?
Kirsty: We, we actually have a saying in IKEA called, stealing with pride.
Charlie: Excellent.
Kirsty: There’s this whole, you know, we can be quite guilty of thinking we need to do something different and new all the time. And actually, if somebody has done something and it worked really well. Steal it, just use it.
Charlie: With pride, I love that.
Kirsty: You don’t need to feel bad about like stealing somebody else’s idea, particularly when it’s an idea from another IKEA store or another IKEA market. Actually, let’s use it, build on it. They’ve tested it, they know it works. How can we replicate that in our market?
Charlie: I think one of my most interesting things I love to do is look at learnings. I know you do this, IKEA as well, you know, learnings from other sectors and other brands and what other programs are up to in, you know, competitive or substitute sectors or actually sectors that have nothing to do, you know, we started off talking about sport, you know, what can retail learn from the sports sector? I think that’s so fascinating. But I’ve honestly never thought about stealing with pride. I shall use that. That’s great.
What about the challenges that you face? I mean, gosh, 190 million members across 30 markets, I think you said, you know, that’s an enormous program. What are some of the challenges you face and how do you manage those as a program of that size and scale?
Kirsty: So for me right now, working on rewards, one of the biggest challenges is rolling it out. So we actually have a little bit of a challenge with every market kind of working in slightly different ways. And then of course we have different legal and tax implications to think about in each of the markets. So actually it becomes a really collaborative process where we spend time kind of planning and working with each of the markets.
And from a rewards project point of view, we’ve also done what we would call a prerequisite document. So this details out all of the kind of ways of working that we need from a market just to be able to make it go live. Because of course, any kind of interaction earnings, so ways of collecting points, they have to be quite standardized from a global point of view. And sometimes we see markets are using kind of maybe different systems or a different way of working. And then it, it wouldn’t necessarily give the customer points as it should do. So there is a really kind of strict, detailed planning process that we go through and kind of a bit of handholding with the markets and supporting them on how it works in the background. So yeah.
Charlie: Great. And not a surprise that you’re taking that kind of thorough, detailed approach to rolling out that sort of that program across all those different markets. I’ve had the privilege of working on that as well, and I do think the implementation and actually making sure that it is just as good as the theory is probably the number one challenge in loyalty marketing, because you touch so many areas of the business. Don’t you? You’re not just working in marketing, you’re touching stores, IT, finance, sales. Absolutely kind of every team is affected by the program, so great to see that sort of, that real focus on implementation and getting it right.
Kirsty: It’s then also different for each of the markets in terms of environment they’re operating in. So depending how mature they are from a loyalty program in general, or whether they have a loyalty program that they did locally before, all of these factors play a big role into how it works and how easy it is to kind of roll out and what modifications we maybe need to make for each market.
Charlie: Gosh. Yes, that’s quite the task. I think you could still be here in a couple of decades working through that one. That’s good. That’s quite the opportunity.
Kirsty: Hopefully it won’t take us that long.
Charlie: What about the kind of lessons you’ve learned on the flip side of that? What are some of the most important lessons that you’ve learned on working on this great big program for this amazing brand that we all love? You know, what sort of things should our listeners be thinking about?
Kirsty: So we touched on it a little bit earlier, this collaboration and the importance of that, one of our IKEA core values is togetherness. And I think actually some of this comes from our Swedish culture and the fact that we value everyone’s opinion and everyone should be involved and kind of along the journey.
But I think it’s so important that you get all the stakeholders that are necessary to kind of buy in and understand where we’re going with this and what we’re trying to achieve, and then also take on board their opinions and their feedback. Everyone is a, is a customer, uh, so actually we can all kind of have an opinion on, on loyalty and what we see as a customer benefit. So I think that’s really important and definitely a big learning along the way.
Charlie: Yeah, I can, I can only imagine how many stakeholders are involved in all those decisions.
Kirsty: Too many, sometimes.
Charlie: And do you know, I can imagine, but you know, you must run those collaboration sessions and then come out with sort of fresh ideas that must make you want to go back to the markets that are already live and optimize at the same time as wanting to get the next markets out. How do you manage that balance between, you know, we’re collaborating with the existing ones and then getting the new ones on board?
Kirsty: So we, we have a very big backlog of wished activities and wished things to the program. But I think it’s, it is, as you say, a balancing act around how do we roll out and what can we roll out as a kind of minimum scalable solution that works for all markets and how do we get it live in as many as possible, as quickly as possible, whilst also when we get opportunity working on some of those backlog activities that we know are going to benefit.
Both the existing markets and also the future ones. So it is a bit of a balancing act. Sometimes there’s conflicting priorities. I would say right now for us, it’s the rollout is the top priority. And then we will kind of come back and add in extra benefits and kind of work on improving it as we go as well.
Charlie: Yeah, I think that makes a lot of sense, and it leads quite nicely into the next question, actually, about what success looks like. And as you’re saying, you know, rolling out those new markets and getting those live is obviously one of your key KPIs. But how do you measure the success of the program across, you know, especially when you’ve got some markets emotional, some transactional, some both? What does that look like? And what does success look like for IKEA and family?
Kirsty: So at the moment, we’ve been doing a lot of work on improving our identification rate. So this was one of the reasons for introducing rewards and adding in points was actually, we had a lot of members, but they weren’t necessarily identifying or scanning that card every time they shopped with us. So that is one big thing.
And then also we’re still focused, I think, on recruitment, but it’s around recruiting the right members and recruiting those that are going to be active and engaged rather than this blanket approach of let’s just get as many members as possible because I think actually it’s, it’s the right members that will give value back to the business. And then also we can give them more value because we know they’re interested in the brand, interested in our product. So it works both ways, I think.
Charlie: Yeah, that’s really nice actually that mutual benefit and that mutual engagement is really key. And I think that’s another big change that we’ve seen in loyalty in the last 10 years.
It did all used to be quantity of members and, you know, programmers would almost, you know, laugh at how many members they had and how they were doing versus their target. But now it’s actually quantity of high quality members that programs are after that are going to actively engage and bring that value back to the business.
Kirsty: I think that’s the thing is we, we definitely started to realize as an industry, the value of certain members rather than just having members. There’s two different things there, right?
Charlie: Yeah, exactly. And I’m sure you’re entering into those same cause and effect debates. You know, are they joining and are they a high value member because they love IKEA or do they love IKEA? Because there are a high value, high quality member. And I think that’s always a really fascinating debate. My theory is it doesn’t matter as long as they’re a high quality, high value member, we should be engaging them and we should bring in the back and we should be thanking them for their business customer recommendation.
Kirsty: I think maybe you have both and they, they fall into both. But as you say, I don’t think it really matters as long as we’re getting value and they’re getting value. I think that’s the main thing.
Charlie: That’s great. And that they’re loving IKEA as much as you know, as much as we know, they do. We’ve talked a lot about how you communicate internally about your program as well, but are there anything, uh, are there other sort of areas about how you run the program internally that you think are best practice?
So you’ve talked about monthly calls, you’ve talked about kickoffs and stakeholder engagement, and obviously some fairly detailed implementation planning, which is brilliant. But you know, what drives that internal success of the program? Is there anything else our listeners should be thinking about?
Kirsty: I would say it’s around how the marketing team and your digital teams. So for us, our solution is an in house in built solution. So actually the combination of those two teams working and coming together with common goals. It’s something that we spent a lot of time working on aligning kind of both sides of those teams.
Charlie: Nice.
Kirsty: And how we’ve improved that moving forward. And I think that’s made a really big difference because actually on the marketing retail side, we’re saying one thing, but the digital teams are also saying the same thing. And when we have aligned priorities, we can get so much more done than when they have different priorities to what we’re talking about doing. So, yeah, I would say that’s probably one of the biggest things.
Charlie: That’s great. And that’s really interesting, actually, that KPI alignment and priority alignment. I sit here with a lot of guests talking about how, you know, they’re almost begging to get in the workflow, begging to get in the workflow. Can we please get something developed? So it’s great to hear that actually you’ve got common priorities. Though I’m sure there’s still a few times where you want things to be done quicker.
Kirsty: Oh, absolutely. there’s still some differing opinions, but I think if you can make your kind of plans for the year together, then that’s the kind of foundation and the starting point. You’re not always going to get everything that you want, maybe from a marketing point of view. And we still have the challenges of particularly when you’re rolling out to new markets, something that we want from a digital point of view, from their point of view might only be relevant for three markets. But we see it as being the future and we know it’s important moving forward, so then they might have that as a lower priority than something that is applicable for all markets.
Charlie: No, I think that’s a really interesting balancing act, isn’t it, for the many or the few and actually for now or for the future, I think those are probably priorities that everyone listening is wrestling with.
What about keeping up to speed, you know, with everything that’s going on in the market as well? You know, we’ve talked a lot about looking internally, but how do you look out? You know, what resources do you rely on to look at what’s going on in the market and where you can steal more ideas with pride from?
Kirsty: So I’m quite lucky in that at IKEA we often have kind of inspiration sessions run by some of our agency partners. So they will come with a kind of outside perspective and present what other brands are doing, what maybe other clients of theirs have done. And that’s always really nice to kind of take that step outside and think back from a customer perspective.
But then I also earlier this year, or end of last year, maybe joined the European Loyalty Associations. I’ve been attending some events through them and some networking sessions and having that one to one connection with different loyalty managers and loyalty people from other retailers has been really interesting for me.
I think at IKEA we can, we have really good network internally and we’re really good at kind of connecting with other teams and connecting with each other, but actually we haven’t always been the best at kind of going to conferences or going to networking events and meeting other people. So I think that’s starting to get better and definitely something I’ve been working on.
Charlie: Oh, that’s great. Yeah, I highly recommend the ELA. I think it’s, it’s a really good organization and the events are really interesting and I’m the same. I think that one on one interaction is brilliant and it’s been great to see the conferences come back. You know, the summit conferences as well, really interesting events. Then they’ve just had the travel one back in June in London and it is, there’s nothing like it for actually being able to talk to other people in other sectors and other brands who are running programs like yours and stealing their ideas, but also getting that kind of real inspiration and just that shared sense of camaraderie, I think, as well, as well as obviously lots of presentations on AI and the future of loyalty that we all get to, to watch all the time.
Kirsty: Also nice to know that the challenges that you face are not challenges you’re facing alone.
Charlie: Exactly.
Kirsty: Loyalty teams can often be quite a small part of a wider business and a wider marketing function. So actually to have other people that are facing the same problems that we face or yeah, just want to share stories is really nice.
Charlie: Yeah, no, I completely agree. It’s it’s really lovely to get out of the day job as well for a little bit, go out and have some fresh inspiration and then bring it back. I always see when my team do it, they always feel really energized. I think as well, when you come back, it kind of gives you a real boost, doesn’t it?
Have you seen any new ideas or innovations recently that you’re particularly proud of, something you’ve done or that you’ve admired or perhaps seen at one of these kind of events or conferences? Anything really standing out?
Kirsty: I think we’ve talked a little bit about the communities already. So maybe actually some of the, the Web3 examples.
I think we’ve, as an industry, we’ve talked quite a lot about the Starbucks Odyssey program in terms of what they’ve done with Web3. And I think even though they’ve closed it right now. I think it’s just really interesting to look back at what did they learn from it? How did it work from them? And then is Web3 and this movement, is it, is it niche or is it the future? I think that’s kind of where my head space is that in terms of trying to understand, is it innovative and the next big thing, or is it an innovation that’s kind of only appealing to a small percentage of our members and something that’s actually going to die off quite quickly? So I think that’s where we’re at at the moment is trying to establish what’s gonna, what’s gonna fly and what’s gonna be the next big thing.
Charlie: And it’s nice that you have a testing culture as well, where you’re sort of, you know, trying ideas out and seeing how they work and then seeing how they roll. And that to me, it looks like, you know, Starbucks, obviously, but on a massive scale, you know, what a trial that they did there and how inspiring to all of us to sort of look at it and then try and figure out, you know, what we can learn from it and how we can apply it to the programs we work on.
Okay. Well, thank you ever so much. As we move to the close, is there anything else you’d like to share with our listeners or if they’ve got any questions for you, what’s the best way for them to reach out to you?
Kirsty: I would say the best way to reach out to me is LinkedIn. And I am very up for virtual speakers. So Fika for those people that don’t know is a very Swedish thing where you would generally have coffee or tea and a cake that’s usually cake, and just chat and share ideas. So it’s quite like an informal kind of way of getting to know other people. And you would maybe talk about kind of work ideas, but also have a little bit of personal time. So I am a big Fika fan and I’m very up for having Fikas as people.
Charlie: Oh, that’s brilliant.
Kirsty: So yeah, just reach out to me on LinkedIn.
Charlie: Oh, well, what an offer, listeners. Please do reach out to Kirsty for Fikas and she can tell you all about IKEA. She can tell you all about her running club, and it would be great. And thank you so much for your time today. You’ve been an absolutely brilliant guest and what a program. An honor to have you on today. Thank you ever so much for coming.
Kirsty: Thank you so much for having me. It was great to be here.
Paula: Thank you so much for listening to this episode of Let’s Talk Loyalty. If you’d like us to send you the latest shows each week, simply sign up for the Let’s Talk Loyalty newsletter on letstalkloyalty.com and we’ll send our best episodes straight to your inbox. And don’t forget that you can follow Let’s Talk Loyalty talk loyalty on any of your favorite podcast platforms. And of course, we’d love for you to share your feedback and reviews. Thanks again for supporting the show.
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